M4A3E8 upgrade

[chrisonord]

So, I bought a bundle of 3 kits off ebay, all 1/72 scale hasegawa armour kits. One a chaffee, one a Stuart and one a sherman M4A3E8. All old kits but were quite cheap. I am wanting to modify /upgrade the sherman and put it in service with my Uranium mine defence force in Africa. I have read that it is an old kit, and not very accurate, so perfect for wiffing. I have been looking at the Israeli M51 for inspiration, so I will modify the turret at the back with a counter weight, and put a T-55 100mm gun barrel on as I already have one in my bits box. I have also ordered a 3D printed upgrade track and wheels set by SS model, off Aliexpress for it. It's going to be in service during the 60's so I will be looking for some time line appropriate add ons for it too. Sorry for scaring some of you guys by using 1/72 scale and armoured vehicles in the same sentence. 
Any ideas will greatly be appreciated, as I have little knowledge of these things other than what I have seen flitting through Google.

[kerick]

Sounds like fun!

[chrisonord]

Sounds like fun!

I am hoping so. I want to use bits I already have where possible, but the stuff I have is either modern or ww2 soviet stuff I got in a box of bits, so some artistic impression (bodgery) shall be used.

[Captain Canada]

72nd scale is perfect for bodgery !

[chrisonord]

72nd scale is perfect for bodgery !

Certainly is 
I have seen pictures of applique armour added to the turret during ww2, so I dare say that some could be added to both the turret and the hull would work too. Thin styrene cut to shape should do the trick. I will have a look at the bits box for a rack too, and some jerry cans. The tank will be diesel engined too.

[Rick Lowe]

If you have spare engine deck parts, replacing the Sherman kits' ones will be the quickest way to indicate an engine change.
Something with a lot of slots, like M-48 or -60...

[chrisonord]

If you have spare engine deck parts, replacing the Sherman kits' ones will be the quickest way to indicate an engine change.
Something with a lot of slots, like M-48 or -60...

Cheers, I will have a look in the bits box and see what I have, as I think I have a dead M60 hull somewhere that could donate some parts. Cheers 

[jcf]

From the Sherman Minutia site:
Sherman Engine Decks

The other diesel Sherman, the Chrysler M4A6 with the Wright R-1820 radial modified
to a diesel by Caterpillar, the RD-1820. It had the long hull of the A57 Multi-bank.
M4A6 RD-1820



Lots of things one would never think to be concerned with :
Sherman Minutia Homepage

BTW M4A3E8 was the development designation, E8 = Experimental 8, the service
designation was M4A3(76)W HVSS. The W stands for wet storage, meaning the ammo
was stored in water filled tanks inside the hull. "W" Shermans did not have applique
armour on the sponson sides, the armour was only applied to tanks with the ammo
storage racks in the sponsons.
The tank used in the film Fury is actually a diesel engined M4A2(76)W HVSS.

[chrisonord]

From the Sherman Minutia site:
Sherman Engine Decks

The other diesel Sherman, the Chrysler M4A6 with the Wright R-1820 radial modified
to a diesel by Caterpillar, the RD-1820. It had the long hull of the A57 Multi-bank.
M4A6 RD-1820



Lots of things one would never think to be concerned with :
Sherman Minutia Homepage

BTW M4A3E8 was the development designation, E8 = Experimental 8, the service
designation was M4A3(76)W HVSS. The W stands for wet storage, meaning the ammo
was stored in water filled tanks inside the hull. "W" Shermans did not have applique
armour on the sponson sides, the armour was only applied to tanks with the ammo
storage racks in the sponsons.
The tank used in the film Fury is actually a diesel engined M4A2(76)W HVSS.

Cheers for the info, I have been looking for a suitable engine grille, and for some reason I didn't find my scrapper M60 hulls, they can't be far away, hopefully the bits I need fit on the deck, as the bits of other tanks I have found are too wide. I have been looking at using a Grant turret on this if I can find one to try it. I will probably need to modify it to fit the ergonomics needed to fit the 100mm gun.

[Rick Lowe]

Be careful with that, the Grant turret is a good bit smaller than the Sherman one.
You could always make a completely new turret, something out of flat plates? Or a T-34 Hexagonal one?

The engine grilles can always be cut down to fit. I wouldn't use the raised part in the middle, though - just the actual grille parts themselves.

You could still add applique armour if you wanted; check the Egyptian one with the AMX turret for RW precedent.

Yeah, the Sherman Minutiae site is great - though there comes a point where you have to say 'enough is enough', otherwise you'll never get the thing built for adding all the little bits and pieces! 

[jcf]

Be careful with that, the Grant turret is a good bit smaller than the Sherman one.
You could always make a completely new turret, something out of flat plates? Or a T-34 Hexagonal one?

The engine grilles can always be cut down to fit. I wouldn't use the raised part in the middle, though - just the actual grille parts themselves.

You could still add applique armour if you wanted; check the Egyptian one with the AMX turret for RW precedent.

Yeah, the Sherman Minutiae site is great - though there comes a point where you have to say 'enough is enough', otherwise you'll never get the thing built for adding all the little bits and pieces! 

The Egyptian Shermans have the applique armour because all of their M4A2 and M4A4
had the ammo racks in the sponsons. 

[Rick Lowe]

That makes sense... I thought it was more a general up-armouring thing.

[Old Wombat]

I have been looking at using a Grant turret on this if I can find one to try it. I will probably need to modify it to fit the ergonomics needed to fit the 100mm gun.

Just remember that the Grant turret was designed to fit a piddling little 37mm gun, a 100mm's recoil would blow it off its turret ring (if you could get it to fit - even without making space for recoil or a gun crew).

[Dizzyfugu]

I exclusively build armor/tanks in 1.72, and esp. in Southe America there have been a couple of interesting M4 upgrades , e .g. the M-60 in Chile (with a high pressure gun) or the Brazilian VBC-CC MB-1A Lag (X1A1 Carcará).

For more inspiration, I did an Uruguayan M4 update on the Hasegawa kit's basis - with the turret from a Japanese Type turret, a dozer blade and other small mods:


1:72 M4A3E8 'Sherman'; vehicle '2 Green/A 247' a.k.a. 'Caesar' of the 1st Compañía Blindada de Tanques, 3rd platoon; Uruguayan Army's Batallón de Blindado Nº 13; Durazno Arsenal/Central West Uruguay, 1986 (Whif/modified Hasegawa kit) by Dizzyfugu, on Flickr

[chrisonord]

I have been looking at using a Grant turret on this if I can find one to try it. I will probably need to modify it to fit the ergonomics needed to fit the 100mm gun.

Just remember that the Grant turret was designed to fit a piddling little 37mm gun, a 100mm's recoil would blow it off its turret ring (if you could get it to fit - even without making space for recoil or a gun crew).

Hmm, that does put a dampener on things that does. I have also looked into a turret from a Pershing, as I have seen pictures of this in real life. That sherman has given me a few more ideas Thomas, cheers for that.