ICM

[NARSES2]

Very weird that the 1/35 kit at twice the size is available for only £15 - £20 more.

Shows you how much of the cost is down to the design and tooling I suppose ? Mind you I'd like to see the costings when it comes to producing a New Mould kit and what the initial break even point for the number of sales is ? At that point you could argue that the price should drop, you'd lose the argument and probably get locked away in Bedlam, but it would be an interesting discussion with the accountants.

[Rick Lowe]

Don't get me started on kits produced from 30+ year-old moulds still being priced at the levels of brand new ones... even though the moulds have been amortized long since...

[kerick]

That's one nice thing about Atlantis. It's all old stuff from decades ago but the price for most hovers around $20 to $25.

[Beermonster58]

Don't get me started on kits produced from 30+ year-old moulds still being priced at the levels of brand new ones... even though the moulds have been amortized long since...

Airfix (though not uniquely) being a prime example. While they at least have the honesty to state on the Vintage Classics boxes that a vintage kit lies therein, they're having a laugh with a lot of the prices.

Nearly a ton for a rather poor and toy like 53 year old 1/24 Harrier? £40 for a 56 year old hovercraft that was a pig to build even when new?

Ok, some admittedly have been priced fairly sensibly but, I sometimes think they take us for idiots.

For sure, nobody is forced to buy them but, I think that's rather beside the point

[Beermonster58]

Very weird that the 1/35 kit at twice the size is available for only £15 - £20 more.

Shows you how much of the cost is down to the design and tooling I suppose ? Mind you I'd like to see the costings when it comes to producing a New Mould kit and what the initial break even point for the number of sales is ? At that point you could argue that the price should drop, you'd lose the argument and probably get locked away in Bedlam, but it would be an interesting discussion with the accountants.

With the relatively low price differential between the two kits, I'd suggest the 1/72 one is very poor value in comparison though , I also accept that is a very subjective comment.

Maybe it's the accountants who need locking away in response to their mad pricing? 😉😂.
I seem to remember similar discussions taking place over the relative cost to value aspect of the Roden 1/144 C-5 Galaxy kits in comparison to their other 1/144 items. Much as I'd like one, I refuse to pay the prices asked.

I'm aware that companies simply don't just pick a figure out the air but, if the market (that's us) doesn't want to pay said price, then its really a moot point

[PR19_Kit]

Maybe it's the accountants who need locking away in response to their mad pricing? 😉😂

DEFINITELY!

I seem to remember similar discussions taking place over the relative cost to value aspect of the Roden 1/144 C-5 Galaxy kits in comparison to their other 1/144 items. Much as I'd like one, I refuse to pay the prices asked.

I'm aware that companies simply don't just pick a figure out the air but, if the market (that's us) doesn't want to pay said price, then its really a moot point

I reckon some of them price their stuff at a level that makes it into a 'collectable' item rather than a kit to build, and then slap something like 'Limited Edition' on the box lid to make people THINK it's 'collectable' even when it's rubbish.

The proper modelling market (us) aren't taken into consideration.

[Beermonster58]

Maybe it's the accountants who need locking away in response to their mad pricing? 😉😂

DEFINITELY!

I seem to remember similar discussions taking place over the relative cost to value aspect of the Roden 1/144 C-5 Galaxy kits in comparison to their other 1/144 items. Much as I'd like one, I refuse to pay the prices asked.

I'm aware that companies simply don't just pick a figure out the air but, if the market (that's us) doesn't want to pay said price, then its really a moot point

I reckon some of them price their stuff at a level that makes it into a 'collectable' item rather than a kit to build, and then slap something like 'Limited Edition' on the box lid to make people THINK it's 'collectable' even when it's rubbish.

The proper modelling market (us) aren't taken into consideration.

Interesting! Never thought of it that way! 😊👍

[jcf]

Um, yeah the 1/35th scale kit price isn't just "£15 to £20" more than that of the new 1/72nd kit. Hannant's has some versions of the 1/35th kit on special offer for £99.95 for a limited time, 1/3rd off the regular list of £154.99. The 1/35th kit is twice the price of the 1/72nd kit from Aviation Megastore. The 1/35th kit is priced at around $200, that's with a discount, from the big US sellers and I expect the 1/72nd kit will be in the $100 range.

There's a lot of fallacious assumptions at work in regards to injection moulded plastic kit production, which is bog standard on every modelling board or FB Group I've been in or followed. As usual the sense of entitlement is eyeroll inducing.

The notion that a kit price should be reduced once the break even point of the original sunk cost is met is gobsmacking. No other industry does that, why would anyone expect that the firms that produce model kits would do so, especially as the majority of the firms are small businesses with narrow margins. It's irrelevant that a sunk cost from years, or decades, previous is amortized and ignores that the cost of production will have increased across the board over that same period of time: materials, moulding*, labour, printing - decals, instructions and packaging etc.. Nothing on the consumables and labour side is static. Then there's the standard operating costs: financing/loan payments; mortgage/lease payments for operating/storage spaces; license(s); utilities; taxes; website hosting etc., which are also not static.

*The majority of the model kit firms today do not have their own in-house moulding capability, it's more cost effective to hire a specialized firm to do the moulding. The cost of financing, maintaining and operating the machines would reduce the already narrow margins, even with any potential capital and operating cost tax reductions - if they qualify. They also do not produce the moulds themselves, again due to cost, and many also don't own the moulds outright because they're paying for the mould creation to be done by a specialist firm, sometimes the same firm that moulds the kits. Which is apparently why Academy "ended up" with many of with the Hobbycraft Canada and Accurate Miniatures moulds, Academy had created the moulds and produced the kitsets. HC and AM defaulted on their contracted payments and Academy took full possession of the moulds.

[Weaver]

Jon makes good points here. Printing in particular has become MUCH more expensive since the 1970s, out of all proportion to general inflation, which raises the cost of decals, instructions and boxes. Just look at what a "bargain" you get when some of the manufacturers sell off over-produced sprues as "simple sets"/"joypacks"/"overtrees" etc... in plastic bags with no decals. It shows you just how much of the price of a regular kits is made up of printing costs. That's the same whether the tooling is 40 days old or 40 years old.

Would you like new kits to come in plain boxes with a stick-on label? Personally I would, but I suspect many would feel short-changed (and retailers wouldn't like it).

Would you like new kits to come without decals, leaving you to buy them separately from either the manufacturers or aftermarket? Ditto.

Having said all that, I do think that they've sometimes got the calculus wrong on new pricing. After all, if the market can't/won't pay the asking price, and you can't reduce it because costs/margin, then the product isn't really economically viable, is it?

A good example is the Airfix Belvedere. The original kit is a waste of time if you want to build an accurate model of ANY Belvedere (let alone a production one) due to the way the clear cockpit is moulded, so £16 for a Vintage Classics re-pop is just an _expensive_ waste-of-time. If they'd taken the time to do at least a new clear moulding for it (as they have done for some other Vintage Classics) and charged £20-£25 for the result, then many more people would have been willing to buy it because realistically, there is NEVER going to be another injection kit of that subject.

[zenrat]

...Would you like new kits to come in plain boxes with a stick-on label? Personally I would, but I suspect many would feel short-changed (and retailers wouldn't like it)...

Yes.
If i'm buying them on line I am more influenced by pictures of a built model and of the sprues than I am of box art.  But I do need some sort of pretty picture to attract my attention when I am casually browsing on line.
And no.
If i'm browsing in an actual shop then I need the full box art experience.  AMT do this well with their current issue model cars.  Nice (often period) artwork on the top and ends of the box.  Details of features and build options on the sides, and on the bottom silhouettes (kudos to me, I spelt that right first go!) of the sprues so you can the detail level instantly.

[The Wooksta!]

Don't get me started on kits produced from 30+ year-old moulds still being priced at the levels of brand new ones... even though the moulds have been amortized long since...

Hasegawa has long been guilty of this yet absolutely SOD ALL is ever said, yet Airfix were getting so much vitriol for doing the same thing that it still rankles.

[jcf]

Don't get me started on kits produced from 30+ year-old moulds still being priced at the levels of brand new ones... even though the moulds have been amortized long since...

Hasegawa has long been guilty of this yet absolutely SOD ALL is ever said, yet Airfix were getting so much vitriol for doing the same thing that it still rankles.

Only the special releases, the standard white-box kits are still inexpensive.

As to nobody whinging about Hasegawa prices, please it's a given on any
model board with Brit members, and it's been true going back for the last
30 years.
🤣

For the folks in the back of the room, Hasegawa doesn't and has never set the
retail prices in any of the export markets. The local importer/distributors have
done that and they're the ones who decided a long time ago that they could
pretty much charge whatever they wanted to for Japanese model kits.

[Beermonster58]

Don't get me started on kits produced from 30+ year-old moulds still being priced at the levels of brand new ones... even though the moulds have been amortized long since...

Hasegawa has long been guilty of this yet absolutely SOD ALL is ever said, yet Airfix were getting so much vitriol for doing the same thing that it still rankles.

Only the special releases, the standard white-box kits are still inexpensive.

As to nobody whinging about Hasegawa prices, please it's a given on any
model board with Brit members, and it's been true going back for the last
30 years.
🤣

For the folks in the back of the room, Hasegawa doesn't and has never set the
retail prices in any of the export markets. The local importer/distributors have
done that and they're the ones who decided a long time ago that they could
pretty much charge whatever they wanted to for Japanese model kits.

Well, "inexpensive"  is a very subjective term 😉😂. Standard boxed items are still, in many cases, priced beyond what I'm willing to pay, even for second hand items.

Your point about importers though is well taken and, you're absolutely right.

[PR19_Kit]

As to nobody whinging about Hasegawa prices, please it's a given on any
model board with Brit members, and it's been true going back for the last
30 years.
🤣

For the folks in the back of the room, Hasegawa doesn't and has never set the
retail prices in any of the export markets. The local importer/distributors have
done that and they're the ones who decided a long time ago that they could
pretty much charge whatever they wanted to for Japanese model kits.

That would have been A A Hales in the UK market of the period.

Dunno who it is these days, and life's too short to go trawling over the net to find out.

[Weaver]

...Would you like new kits to come in plain boxes with a stick-on label? Personally I would, but I suspect many would feel short-changed (and retailers wouldn't like it)...

Yes.
If i'm buying them on line I am more influenced by pictures of a built model and of the sprues than I am of box art.  But I do need some sort of pretty picture to attract my attention when I am casually browsing on line.
And no.
If i'm browsing in an actual shop then I need the full box art experience.  AMT do this well with their current issue model cars.  Nice (often period) artwork on the top and ends of the box.  Details of features and build options on the sides, and on the bottom silhouettes (kudos to me, I spelt that right first go!) of the sprues so you can the detail level instantly.

My thought was to use those sturdy white mailing boxes favoured by the likes of Freightdog, then have a large sticker which goes right across the top and over both ends. It serves to seal the box, it can have nice art on the top, and the end bits satisfy the retailers' need to see what they are when stacked on the shelves.

The other approach would be to go for the full-colour tray box, but use all sides of both parts to carry stuff that would otherwise be in the instructions, such as colour-printed paint schemes, background info and all the "do not eat this model kit" BS.