Discussion Mk II

[jcf]

The Chrysler steam powered "caterpillar" from Von Braun's cheesy novel.

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[kerick]

The Shuttle C was a strictly cargo concept studied by NASA back in the 80's. The advantage was thought to be able to haul more payload to orbit without a crew, crew quarters, wings and using end of life engines with no requirement to be recovered.
I started to build one quite a while ago and got bogged down by AMS. I'm throwing this out there so maybe someone else will be interested and try to finish one.

[kerick]

Also another possible project was a Dream Chaser or X-38 type of spaceplane launched on a Titan IV type rocket.



I've got the rocket parts so no problem there. The spaceplane might have to be scratch built.

[Weaver]

In the wake of the Challenger disaster, there were several proposals to replace the Solid Rocket Boosters with liquid fuel boosters, each using two F1 engines from the Saturn V first stage. The advantage of these was that they could be shut down at any point, thus expanding the possibilities for a safe abort and closing the "black zones" in the launch profile in which no realistic recovery was possible. Another advantage was that with the boosters shut down, ejection seats became a more viable escape method, since the crew wouldn't be falling through the boosters' exhaust plume. Ejection seats were actually fitted on the first few Shuttle flights, which were conducted with only two crew, but removed subsequently when they began flying with some of the crew on the mid-deck.

Inspired by this, I have a plan for a "safer shuttle" which adopts the liquid fuel boosters. It also extends the crew cabin by 10 feet at the expense of the payload bay, and has the crew limited to 6, all of whom sit in ejection seats on the upper deck for launch and landing. These not only add escape options during ascent, but also provide a much safer method of bail-out after re-entry than the sketchy parachuting-off-a-pole method adopted in real life. To compensate somewhat for the loss of cargo capacity, the newly stretched mid-deck would feature a permanent airlock at the rear, making it uneccessary to carry one in the front of the cargo bay on many missions, although a docking adaptor would still be needed for docking with the ISS or other spacecraft.

The shuttle's 60ft cargo bay was defined by the perceived need to carry KH-11 Big Bird spy satellites, but in fact, no KH-11 was ever flown on it, other than the Hubble Space Telescope which was based on a KH-11. The Hubble could have been launched on a Titan just like the KH-11s, and all other full-size payloads were designed around the 60ft bay because it was available, not because it was neccessary. They could just as well have been designed around a 45ft bay. The only consequence of this would be that launching the ISS in smaller installements would have taken longer, or the station would have been smaller for the same number of launches.

I've got some parts for this project but I still have no clear idea how to proceed with others, so I'm not going to even try to do it for this GB. If anyone else is inspired by this, please feel free to use any or all of these ideas.

[McColm]

The Shuttle C was a strictly cargo concept studied by NASA back in the 80's. The advantage was thought to be able to haul more payload to orbit without a crew, crew quarters, wings and using end of life engines with no requirement to be recovered.
I started to build one quite a while ago and got bogged down by AMS. I'm throwing this out there so maybe someone else will be interested and try to finish one.

I've got these parts in 1/288 scale, thanks for the info. At least I'll know what it's supposed to look like 👍

[PR19_Kit]

Hmmm, now there's an idea. 

I have a 'full stack' 1/72 Shuttle kit AND a Hubble telescope kit as well up in The Loft. It'd make a great RW diorama with them both suspended close to each other with wire, ir clear styrene rods to support them.

[McColm]

Hmmm, now there's an idea. 

I have a 'full stack' 1/72 Shuttle kit AND a Hubble telescope kit as well up in The Loft. It'd make a great RW diorama with them both suspended close to each other with wire, ir clear styrene rods to support them.

That's a huge undertaking, not to mention where you're going to put it during construction.

[PR19_Kit]

Hmmm, now there's an idea. 

I have a 'full stack' 1/72 Shuttle kit AND a Hubble telescope kit as well up in The Loft. It'd make a great RW diorama with them both suspended close to each other with wire, ir clear styrene rods to support them.

That's a huge undertaking, not to mention where you're going to put it during construction.

Very, VERY true, but it's a good idea. 

[Weaver]

Design it with storage/transport to shows in mind.

Short tubes glued into the models so that you can insert/remove the clear rods, try to make the solar panels detachable, etc...

For a space diorama, matt black wires/rods often look as good as clear.

[kerick]

There are quite a few pics of the Shuttle C concept on the good old interwebby thingy. When I read about McColm's plans I thought he needed another project or two. 

[McColm]

There are quite a few pics of the Shuttle C concept on the good old interwebby thingy. When I read about McColm's plans I thought he needed another project or two. 

Thanks 

[Gondor]

The Chrysler steam powered "caterpillar" from Von Braun's cheesy novel.

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When I saw that, it reminded me of the "moon buggy" from Diamonds Are Forever

[kerick]

I've got the parts for a Titan III-C that I might try to scratch up a Dyna soar type of spaceplane for.

[Gondor]

There was a British version that was moulded by Spot-On Designs, although if you manage to contact Joe, whether he has any available is a good question.

[kerick]

I just checked and the Titan missile I have is 1/144th scale. It's from the old Monogram US and USSR missile set. I have extras of the biggest Soviet missile which will double as SRBs.