General Discussion

[jcf]

Chris, thank you very much for what you do and all of your efforts to keep this forum on an even keel.
Well, as even as it can be.
It is very much appreciated.

[kitbasher]

Chris, thank you very much for what you do and all of your efforts to keep this forum on an even keel.
Well, as even as it can be.
It is very much appreciated.

Indeed it is 👍

[Mossie]

I agree.

I'm entirely with Chris on this in taking it personal. I've had a lot of cr@p going on in life recently so I thought modding a GB would be a sweet distraction.  Boy, have I been proved wrong so far.

Myself, Steven and Chris are aware this is a difficult set of rules to set down. We've done this in good faith. We were in the process of tightening the rules when it all got out of hand; too much to process with real life running in the background. It feels like some people have deliberately tugged at the ends to see if it unravels, I hope not.

I could have gone full David Banner.  I was all ready to step away, but I don't want to, I'd rather everyone settle down. We'll let Chris enjoy his week away. I'll chat to Steven and we'll finalise a set of rules that will be tighter and tie up loose ends, as we intended. Discussion continues to be welcome, but I expect everyone to be civil.

I'm changing my avatar to reflect how I've felt (I mean it light heartedly  ). But if it changes again (I'm pretty sure you'll work it out), I'll be stepping away.

Seriously, let's work this out and have some fun building fake versions of plastic toys. 

[kerick]

Chris, thank you very much for what you do and all of your efforts to keep this forum on an even keel.
Well, as even as it can be.
It is very much appreciated.

Indeed it is 👍

Keeping this website running must be an every day job and a lot of work. Special thanks to people who moderate the GBs. I'm sure it takes a load of work off of our mastermind Narses2. I really appreciate what people do here. I thoroughly enjoy the creativity and positive attitude found here.
I know that if I've ever posted something that sounded like a personal attack on anyone here it was unintentional and I truly apologize.

Let's get back to solving the problem. My interpretation was of space traveling race who was reaching out into their solar system and traveling between all the planets and their moons. They just haven't reached the point of interstellar travel. Some are hauling goods and passengers while others may be a military/law enforcement type. Of course there could be some pirate types too. If you want to make it Earth that's cool or go to a galaxy far far away where no man has gone before and have a blast. Let's just get back to chopping up some plastic and having fun. I hope this is helpful.

[McColm]

This might seem a bit radical but what if the Lunar vehicles was taken out of the equation and spacecraft just left to build?

[NARSES2]

Right having calmed down a bit over a few large glasses of Belgian beer and having had a few thoughts about this the only thing I can suggest is this :-

1. We suspend the start of the GB for a month, ie : to 1st August. The other 2 GB's of the season would likewise start a month later then planed.

2. We consider where we want to go regarding three critical questions.

   a) Does this GB only refer to our solar system, or does it apply to any solar system ?

   b) If it applys to any solar system then does it include vehicles operated by alien species. ie : How far down the sci-fi path do we want to go.

As an aside my interpretation of what this GB was intended to produce was builds based on existing or proposed technology from here on Earth.

[Old Wombat]

Seriously, let's work this out and have some fun building fake versions of plastic toys. 

Speak for yourself ! 

To (mis)quote buzzbomb, "I build accurate scale replicas of things that never existed!" 

[zenrat]

Right having calmed down a bit over a few large glasses of Belgian beer and having had a few thoughts about this the only thing I can suggest is this :-

1. We suspend the start of the GB for a month, ie : to 1st August. The other 2 GB's of the season would likewise start a month later then planed.

2. We consider where we want to go regarding three critical questions.

   a) Does this GB only refer to our solar system, or does it apply to any solar system ?

   b) If it applys to any solar system then does it include vehicles operated by alien species. ie : How far down the sci-fi path do we want to go.

As an aside my interpretation of what this GB was intended to produce was builds based on existing or proposed technology from here on Earth.

I think asking us what we think is a mistake.  It'll lead to more arguing.
Have a three way mod discussion and then just tell us.

[Mossie]

Seriously, let's work this out and have some fun building fake versions of plastic toys. 

Speak for yourself ! 

To (mis)quote buzzbomb, "I build accurate scale replicas of things that never existed!" 

You don't play with yours??? Neeoow, dakkka dakka dakka, boom!!!

[Weaver]

Right having calmed down a bit over a few large glasses of Belgian beer and having had a few thoughts about this the only thing I can suggest is this :-

1. We suspend the start of the GB for a month, ie : to 1st August. The other 2 GB's of the season would likewise start a month later then planed.

2. We consider where we want to go regarding three critical questions.

   a) Does this GB only refer to our solar system, or does it apply to any solar system ?

   b) If it applys to any solar system then does it include vehicles operated by alien species. ie : How far down the sci-fi path do we want to go.

As an aside my interpretation of what this GB was intended to produce was builds based on existing or proposed technology from here on Earth.

That could be a good idea. Another question that's come up is if the scope is limited to our solar system, then does "moon" mean just Earth's moon or any moon in the system? It matters because some moons have atmospheres and some have liquid/ice surfaces, both of which require very different vehicles from the stereotypical "lunar rover".

If anything I've said seemed personal Chris, then I apologise as that was NOT my intention.

The point I was trying to make was that there's a trade-off between "loose and inclusive" rules and "tightly defined rules", with prices to pay whatever you choose, confusion and scope arguments being the price for the former and possibly lower participation being the price for the latter.

[Weaver]

I'll chat to Steven and we'll finalise a set of rules that will be tighter and tie up loose ends, as we intended. Discussion continues to be welcome, but I expect everyone to be civil.

Glad to hear it. I think tighter and better-defined rules produce better GBs, even though it means those writing the rules may have to "be Teacher" and say no to people sometimes.

[PR19_Kit]

I'm going to solve these problems for myself by NOT entering the GB.

Sci-fi isn't really my thing, although I appreciate the efforts that others make in that field (especially Nonobars!  ) and I've got far too many builds under way already.

[zenrat]

I'll chat to Steven and we'll finalise a set of rules that will be tighter and tie up loose ends, as we intended. Discussion continues to be welcome, but I expect everyone to be civil.

Glad to hear it. I think tighter and better-defined rules produce better GBs, even though it means those writing the rules may have to "be Teacher" and say no to people sometimes.

Whereas I think slack rules are better, letting people have fun within a vaguely defined envelope.

[Old Wombat]

I'm possibly not the one to poke my oar in here, because I enter so few GBs, but;


I can see both points of view & have no issue with either.

However, I can't see why we can't do a bit of both, alternating between GBs with tighter rules around what is acceptable within the GB & those with looser rules allowing more freedom of expression.

The title of the GB should be the give-away;

For example;

This "The Lunar Vehicles/Spacecraft GB" implies, to me, a tighter field of expression around vehicles to travel ON our Moon (Luna) and TO/FROM our Moon (Luna) BUT I don't see anything in the description that means you can't be inspired by the likes of Francis Godwin, Daniel Defoe, Edgar Allan Poe, Jules Verne, H. G Wells or  Georges Méliès, or any classical depictions of flying to the Moon, or the post-WW2/pre-Apollo science fiction writers & artists. There's still room for your imaginations to work.

While "Space GB", leaves the door wide open to anything science, science fiction or fantasy based across any planet, star system, galaxy, time period or universe your mind can come up with that might or might have ever existed (or not).

One of these formats will work for one group of people, while some will appreciate the other, others may like both. I can't see too many people liking neither (subject matter aside, we're talking GB formats here).

If we leave this one relatively tightly constrained, then the following one should be more loosely constrained (I can't remember which GB is up next, sorry), & I think the title does lend itself to a more tightly constrained GB this time around.

[Mossie]

I'll chat to Steven and we'll finalise a set of rules that will be tighter and tie up loose ends, as we intended. Discussion continues to be welcome, but I expect everyone to be civil.

Glad to hear it. I think tighter and better-defined rules produce better GBs, even though it means those writing the rules may have to "be Teacher" and say no to people sometimes.

Whereas I think slack rules are better, letting people have fun within a vaguely defined envelope.

This was my reasoning at the beginning and I've modded others on this principle. It turned out not to be the case for this GB. There's no right or wrong answer, just personal preference.

Anyway, we're getting bogged down in general rules discussion. That needs to taken into a thread at another time.

What we need to discuss now is Chris's points. He's the Department Head, McColm and I are faculty. Steven and I are ready to make the call if required. Personally, I agree with Fred and now think that's the way the GB should go (talking as a member, concurrent with my mod role).

I'm possibly not the one to poke my oar in here, because I enter so few GBs, but;


I can see both points of view & have no issue with either.

However, I can't see why we can't do a bit of both, alternating between GBs with tighter rules around what is acceptable within the GB & those with looser rules allowing more freedom of expression.

The title of the GB should be the give-away;

For example;

This "The Lunar Vehicles/Spacecraft GB" implies, to me, a tighter field of expression around vehicles to travel ON our Moon (Luna) and TO/FROM our Moon (Luna) BUT I don't see anything in the description that means you can't be inspired by the likes of Francis Godwin, Daniel Defoe, Edgar Allan Poe, Jules Verne, H. G Wells or  Georges Méliès, or any classical depictions of flying to the Moon, or the post-WW2/pre-Apollo science fiction writers & artists. There's still room for your imaginations to work.

While "Space GB", leaves the door wide open to anything science, science fiction or fantasy based across any planet, star system, galaxy, time period or universe your mind can come up with that might or might have ever existed (or not).

One of these formats will work for one group of people, while some will appreciate the other, others may like both. I can't see too many people liking neither (subject matter aside, we're talking GB formats here).

If we leave this one relatively tightly constrained, then the following one should be more loosely constrained (I can't remember which GB is up next, sorry), & I think the title does lend itself to a more tightly constrained GB this time around.

Yes, the title was always the leader here, that got lost a bit in discussion.  Let's focus on this GB, any discussion of the next GB should wait until then.