Author Topic: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” Finished!!!  (Read 15756 times)

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Offline PR19_Kit

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” build!!!
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2015, 08:56:09 am »
IIRC the very high wing loading of the XB-51 was one of the points that went against it during the USAF's fly-off. The winning Canberra was the exact opposite of course with its massive wing area.
Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings, and/or a longer fuselage

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Kit

Offline Logan Hartke

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” build!!!
« Reply #16 on: July 31, 2015, 09:23:55 am »
Indeed. It's like an F-104 vs the Javelin. The XB-51 was designed to very fast at low level. It's often said that it wasn't maneuverable, but that's not fair. Both the XB-51 and the Canberra were very maneuverable, just in completely different ways.

Cheers,

Logan

Offline PR19_Kit

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” build!!!
« Reply #17 on: July 31, 2015, 12:10:53 pm »
It's like an F-104 vs the Javelin.

Hehehe, that makes me laugh.  ;D :lol:

It's difficult to imagine two jet fighters that were SO far apart from each other in almost every aspect.  ;D
Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings, and/or a longer fuselage

...and I'm not a closeted 'Take That' fan, I'm a REAL fan! :)

Regards
Kit

Offline Logan Hartke

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” build!!!
« Reply #18 on: July 31, 2015, 12:29:04 pm »
I know. The XB-51 and Canberra were really apples and oranges, too. I have great respect for both aircraft, but it's definitely a case of horses for courses.

Cheers,

Logan

Offline NARSES2

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” build!!!
« Reply #19 on: August 01, 2015, 05:39:07 am »
Interesting with the canopies. My build will be straight out of the box however, when I get started that is. Probably in a couple of weeks. I've a Vautour which will donate the markings and she will get RAF markings. In my world Britain and France both used Canberra's and Vautours. Cabberra's as bomber/P.R. aircraft ; Vautour's for Interdiction and ground attack
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Offline trickyrich

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” build!!!
« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2015, 07:37:25 am »
Ok time to start this build!

First off the rear fuselage was jointed together…oh that was fun too!! As can be seen the gaps are quite noticeable as well as the now warped wheel well! Unlike all the other resin models I have this one didn’t like the warm/hotish water bath at all, at first it did try to straighten the warped bits but as they cooled down they did crazy stuff!!! So there is a bit of work to do bit nothing like I have had to do on the Arado!!



The forward fuselage section is just as bad but this time one side is longer than the other!! The water bath didn’t do this!!



So with the two sections together you can see the fun I am going to have!! Nothing some filler and wet-n-dry won’t fix!



Now some of the updating work I will do, the tail section is quite plain, on the profile Logan has added a spike on the “T” junction, I’ll add something similar except it will be a little squarer in shape to house an antenna array.



There is something wrong with this picture!!! All three engines are meant to be GE J-47-GE-13’s so you’d expect them all to have intakes with the same opening areas! Clearly they didn’t get this one right! MY beast will have the later J-47-GE-27’s (as fitted to the F-86F’s, these had 5970lbs of thrust as opposed to the original 5200lbs ones of those fitted to the XB-51’s. So revised intakes are a must and the fuselage actually has a recessed section in it for the upper intake, so this one will have an enlarged intake and larger recessed section.



I have had a look at the three different options I have for the canopy, original, B-57G version, and one from a F-4E. While the B-57G one looks good from the side profile it’s quite wide when viewed from above and the fuselage is quite narrow. The F-4 one suits the era quite nicely so that’s the way I’ll be going, plus it will be much easier to profile it in!



Finally I had a look at some of the options I will have for stores. Due to it being a wee bit on the thirsty side, drop tanks are a must! Now being a Tropic Moon beast with the high-tech nose early LGB’s or Bullpup’s will be the go, and maybe AN/ALQ-87 or AN/ALQ-101 ECM pods.



Plus I have to build a new cockpit area and new main wheel wells!

While there appears to be quite a bit of work required it is all quite manageable. This should be a fun build and with luck I’ll dive right into it next weekend!

Offline PR19_Kit

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 02/8
« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2015, 10:37:17 am »
IIRC the #2 engine on the XB-51 was only a 'part timer' which was used for take-off and over the target dash speed. As such the intake was blanked off when the engine was shut down and that rotated just like the bomb bay door.

I think the rotating bit was maybe 6 ft long, only the rear half of which was the bit you can see on the model. The front half had a dip in the top of the fuselage which when rotated became a nice smooth fairing to the fin. It's difficult to explain so I'll try and draw the two configurations. Watch this space....
Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings, and/or a longer fuselage

...and I'm not a closeted 'Take That' fan, I'm a REAL fan! :)

Regards
Kit

Offline PR19_Kit

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 02/8
« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2015, 10:53:59 am »
Here's my sketch of how I reckon it worked, and below are a couple of small pics that show the #2 intake in both closed and open  positions.






« Last Edit: March 11, 2018, 09:56:30 am by PR19_Kit »
Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings, and/or a longer fuselage

...and I'm not a closeted 'Take That' fan, I'm a REAL fan! :)

Regards
Kit

Offline trickyrich

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 02/8
« Reply #23 on: August 02, 2015, 02:57:19 pm »
arrr I was wondering about that, I had seen the top photo but wasn't to sure what the go was there.


Either way the #2 intake as it is is wrong so it does need to be modified.

Offline NARSES2

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 02/8
« Reply #24 on: August 03, 2015, 06:50:36 am »
Interesting that you make a front and rear fuselage and join them. I tend to make two complete fuselage halves and then join them in a traditional way. Having said that it's a very long fuselage  :blink:

I really am looking forward to this build and will be taking notes  :thumbsup:
Decals my @r$e!

Offline trickyrich

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 02/8
« Reply #25 on: August 03, 2015, 03:35:25 pm »
with both sets being warped I thought it might be a bit easier to handle, plus the fuselage is really LONG!! But this mightn't be the best way to tackle it.....I have been known to make extra work for myself with my builds! :banghead:

Offline NARSES2

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 02/8
« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2015, 07:48:26 am »
plus the fuselage is really LONG!!

Tell me about it, I'm still trying to come to terms with it
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Offline KiwiZac

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 02/8
« Reply #27 on: August 04, 2015, 03:26:08 pm »
Looking at the moulding issues and warpage, you're a far braver soul than I! I love the concept though so please stick with it.
With warm regards from Whanganui, New Zealand

Offline trickyrich

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 02/8
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2015, 03:23:13 am »
Well the fun has begun and I have a workbench covered in resin dust…it would have been so much easier if it had been a plastic model!

So we’ll start with the rear fuselage section first. Thought I have been asked why I didn’t first glue the front and rear sections first, then glue the halves together…good question! Probably because I like to make things difficult for myself! But really with the sections being quite warped and fuselages being different lengths doing it this way is the easiest. Plus she’s very long it would make life a bit harder as I’m bound to break something, along with the fact I’m rebuilding the wheel wells as well!

So with the rear section glued together and given a quick rub down off we go.

First up the wheel well, I’ll be doing both the same. So I make a basic box for the well with the side the right height, I’m not worried about the ends for the moment, just that they are longer then necessary (who could have guessed a simple box would be so hard to make!!!). Then using the model and reference photos I add some detail, it’s not quite exact but looks the part. Then fit….well there is a little bit more involved in this part, for the rear one I had to first grind out the old one so the new one will fit, quite a long process. The front section will be a bit different as because I’m fitting a new cockpit as well I’ll do all this work before I join the halves together.



It actually doesn’t look to bad at all, there are quite a few sins which are hidden but it does look so much better, plus it would have been a horrible job to fill those gaps! As it turns out the models wheel well are too short and the doors are even smaller…guess I’ll be custom making those as well!





Next up the intake for the #2 engine, as it turns out I missed something completely with this one! The #2 engine was only used for take offs, so it was fitted with a rotating cover/fairing. In its open position there should be a lower section of the intake visible. So an old drop tank was sacrificed for this job along with another one for the intake proper further in. Plus the upper part of the intake was removed and enlarged slightly. I now have an intake with roughly the same inlet area as the other two.  After some filler, sanding and profiling she should look great!



Next up the spike on the tail, it seems some aircraft didn’t had it (suspect early prototype/s) while later ones had different shaped ones. So I’ve made one up, it still needs some tiding up plus I’m probably going to add another fairing as well…hmm think about that one.



I have started the basic shaping of the canopy but won’t do too much more until the cockpit is done and the fuselage is together. Speaking of the cockpit I have decided to go with an aftermarket one for the B-57 (oh I’ve decided to use that one instead of the F-4’s one) as it will be simpler and look much better.

So just taped together…… I love the look of it!! She’s a big aircraft with a long body and not so big wings, by all reports she handled nicely and was fast, her only real problem was she was thirsty!





It’s turning out to be more than a simple conversion but that seems to be the case for any of my builds like this. I still think the Collect-Aire 1/48th version would have been a simpler build…I even have a Collect-Aire B-57G ready to donate its nose as well! Well at least I have until late November, when the GB finishes, to complete her!

Offline zenrat

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Re: Martin B-51G Panther “Tropic Moon III” UPDATE 05/8
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2015, 03:55:34 am »
Jeez you work fast.  Like your astroturf cutting mat  :lol:
Fred

Another ill conceived, lazily thought out, crudely executed and badly painted piece of half arsed what-if modelling muppetry from zenrat industries.

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