What if

Picture Post => Current and Finished Projects => Aircraft => Topic started by: DaFROG on September 04, 2009, 03:20:11 am

Title: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on September 04, 2009, 03:20:11 am
Yes folks it's that time of year again when the powers that be think it's a good idea to send me to Adelaide and make me work 60 hours a week on a powerstation without the stabilising influence of Mrs frog.
This time I came prepared with white metal figures to paint.
However I recently traded some decals for a what i thought was a 1/144 B26 and some decals (came with an additional F4) and they were sent to my work address (theres someone there during business hours unlike home) and they forwarded to the Adelaide office where I'm currently working.
The upshot of all this is that I will be making a consolidated model 35 (basically a twin engined B32) designed for the chilean navy. I was actually inspired by the Me 264 but the B32 looks similar appart from the vertical tail and the prototype had twin tails and also a glass house b29/me264 nose initially i think.
Also i have Chilean decals here and though it would be best if it was an American design.

(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000426.jpg)

The plan is to remove the bit infront of the wing and add it aft of the wing. such sectioning will require a razor saw but i didn't bring one. Fear not dear readers the serrated steak knives supplied with my accommodation look perfect for the job..... what me butcher a kit? never. The card is a rewards card from a store i have never visited since getting the card it is my version of credit card modelling. Instead of using cards to by stuff i cut out teh middle man and make stuff out of cards
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Just call me Ray on September 05, 2009, 12:17:57 pm
Nice GameTraders card :)
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: sideshowbob9 on September 07, 2009, 04:10:18 am
Interesting idea! Looking forward to seeing more.
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on September 10, 2009, 05:04:12 am
(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000436.jpg)
implements of distruction. above is the original proportions below showing the plug removed and replaced aft of the wing.

(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000454.jpg)
early construction photograph, it is unknown why consolidated painted the factory floor to resemble a newspaper or why grossly overscale pieces of masking tape are present

(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000455.jpg)

i may yet shorten the nacelles slightly and make them look less radial and I'm not sure if the dorsal turret will be retained
Title: I Really Like Where This is Going!
Post by: sequoiaranger on September 10, 2009, 09:18:52 am
Can't wait to see more!
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Sauragnmon on September 10, 2009, 10:56:02 am
I'm with SR - this is quite an interesting progression so far, very interesting stuff.
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Brian da Basher on September 10, 2009, 02:59:13 pm
That's some mighty skilled kit surgery there Frog. I like the idea of modifying the engine nacelles. Have you considered converting them to inlines? Since your aircraft will be Chilean, going from radials to inlines would be an interesting counterpoint to the Argentinians putting radials on license-built Mosquitoes.

Regardless of the direction you go in, I'm enjoying watching this project take shape!
 :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on September 10, 2009, 03:45:09 pm
Tanks Brian especially from one with your mad skills (emphasis on themad  ;D )
Engines will be in lines, although i don't have anything other than an F4 here to make them from. I'm going with some cosmetic mods of the cowlings (remove radial type "gills" or whatever they are called) and claiming Alison V3420's with annular fan forced radiators and contra props. from what I've seen it should be possible to fit them into circular section nacelles with oil coolers, torbus etc underneath, though the would be slightly larger than standard radial ones which dovetails nicely with the slight scaleorama (1/144 to ~1/160 i think). I think the model 35 was designed from the outset with in lines though (see scaleorama) what with the B32 not going into full scale production as it would have used the same radial a the B29 and the chief of the chilean airforces aversion to radials, something about liking long thin bendy shafts rather than shafts that aren't really shafts at all, crank shafts of course what were you thinking.....
Title: Gills and Airflow
Post by: sequoiaranger on September 10, 2009, 04:39:37 pm
>I'm going with some cosmetic mods of the cowlings (remove radial type "gills" or whatever they are called) and claiming Alison V3420's with annular fan forced radiators and contra props. from what I've seen it should be possible to fit them into circular section nacelles with oil coolers,...<

Don't' be too hasty to eliminate the "gills" of the radials. ANY airflow into the nacelle has to come out somewhere. That is, if you dream of an annular fan-forced radiators, you still have air moving from the front of the nacelle THROUGH or PAST a heat-radiating device and out somewhere. You can't force air into a closed space, and trapped air certainly won't do any cooling. The air moving THROUGH picks up heat by conduction and radiation as it goes by the cylinders or radiating fins and coils, thereby cooling them, and than hopefully transports the warmed air out into the sky. You may want to modify the gills or move them, but I wouldn't eliminate them if you are intending any sort of air cooling within the nacelle.

Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: joncarrfarrelly on September 10, 2009, 05:23:08 pm
Twin 3420s would be cool as one of the layouts for the 'actual' Model 35 was a four-engined aircraft with the engines arranged push-pull fashion. A different way of getting four-for-the-drag-cost-of-two.  ;D

The various Model 35 iterations eventually led to the Model 36 (B-36).

Dwg from Magnesium Overcast.

Jon

Title: Re: Gills and Airflow
Post by: DaFROG on September 10, 2009, 06:46:26 pm
>I'm going with some cosmetic mods of the cowlings (remove radial type "gills" or whatever they are called) and claiming Alison V3420's with annular fan forced radiators and contra props. from what I've seen it should be possible to fit them into circular section nacelles with oil coolers,...<

Don't' be too hasty to eliminate the "gills" of the radials. ANY airflow into the nacelle has to come out somewhere. That is, if you dream of an annular fan-forced radiators, you still have air moving from the front of the nacelle THROUGH or PAST a heat-radiating device and out somewhere. You can't force air into a closed space, and trapped air certainly won't do any cooling. The air moving THROUGH picks up heat by conduction and radiation as it goes by the cylinders or radiating fins and coils, thereby cooling them, and than hopefully transports the warmed air out into the sky. You may want to modify the gills or move them, but I wouldn't eliminate them if you are intending any sort of air cooling within the nacelle.

I realise that just don't want the "gills" as they are associated with radials there's actually something that looks like a chute (like the rear radiator flap on a mustang) just in front of the main gear doors, I'll probably add a few other bits for exhausts etc on the nacelles somewhere.

@JCF

That's just plain nuts, I actually searched (very briefly) for the model 35 just to see if it was taken/what it was but didn't find anything. To my knowledge I've never seen that drawing before the similarities with my whiff are freaking me out ;D only major difference appart from engines appears to be the longer forward fuselage.Also I dreamed up a similar treatment for the Do(2/3)17 (http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic,24247.msg353919.html#msg353919) last time i was in Adelaide. Must be something in the water over here it certainly tastes funny enough, so funny infact I've been not drinking it, must be absorbing it through my skin when i shower, have to stop doing that i guess :wacko: :wacko: :wacko:
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Sauragnmon on September 10, 2009, 07:11:48 pm
You could still get rid of the gills per se if you had side vents like on the FW-190 and Ki-100 - If you're using an inline engine, you've got the space under a radial cowling to dump the airflow through across the radiators and down the engine block before it comes out down the nacelles.
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on September 17, 2009, 06:17:29 am
(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000501.jpg)
I've inverted the profile of the engines to make them shorter and allow them to be fitted upside down
(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000502.jpg)
I'm plannning on fitting an F4 nose gear for double wheels, and will also allow me to shorten the nose gear bay. The propellers wil eb slightly cropped for clearance.
(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000503.jpg)
much much PSR thing to come. the wing tips are mostly done. The nose is not on yet as i need to sort the cockpit out first.
Unfortunately progress has been slow due to my 60 hour weeks and teh weather which has nessicated much cycling
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Brian da Basher on September 17, 2009, 04:14:20 pm
I'm watching with rapt attention! I like how you "reversed" the engines.
 :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on September 18, 2009, 06:15:47 pm
no much of an update engines are on and PSR'd and scoops are attached underneath (ram air induction into twin turbo superchargers no doubt)
The seats in the cockpit are modified from the angle bracket type ones included in the hobbycraft F4 (I decided with the limited materials at my disposal over here that a glass house nose would be too difficult, also the B32 and JCF's drawing of the model 35 have a flightdeck anyway).

(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000527.jpg)

Just a bit of rescribing and fuselage PSR to go and it'll be ready for paint, don't hold your breath though I'm gonna be busy mountainbiking tomorrow (assuming i can remember how to ride a bike with gears and suspension)
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Sauragnmon on September 19, 2009, 01:38:12 am
The engines look pretty sweet with those scoops on the underside, very interesting look so far.
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Geoff on October 04, 2009, 02:23:35 am
That looks really good!
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Stargazer2006 on October 04, 2009, 02:36:23 am
What an interesting project!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: batmancustoms on October 04, 2009, 02:47:12 am
 :thumbsup:  I like!
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on October 12, 2009, 02:43:00 am
much PSR, rescribing, filling of botched scribing and rescribing the rescribing has been occured
(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000751.jpg)

I've also started painting some of the smaller parts, I decided to liven up the landing gear doors by drawing some detail on with a pencil, i think i will detail the gear bays this way as well
(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000755.jpg)
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: batmancustoms on October 12, 2009, 02:45:04 am
looking great!
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: ysi_maniac on October 27, 2009, 11:04:04 am
This is much promising indeed! :thumbsup: :bow: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on October 27, 2009, 06:02:05 pm
it may even get finished in the distant future.
I am currently working 12-14 hours a day (including sundays).
According the the wonderful people who run the power station I'm working on the fact that I am not at home means I don't have anything to do in my spare time so i should spend every waking minute working.

there was also the infamous meeting in which i was grilled about results for some samples which they hadn't given me yet, all in all much fun and frivolity.

unfortunately after days like that i hardly have the energy to press the buttons on the TV remote  >:(
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Ian the Kiwi Herder on October 30, 2009, 01:57:56 am
Really like the way this is headed, brilliant work so far.

Ian
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on November 07, 2009, 02:51:53 pm
(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000842.jpg)

(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000843.jpg)

(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000845.jpg)

(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll97/DaFROGtypeX/Model%2035/P1000846.jpg)

finnished have to drop mrs frog off at work more text later
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Stargazer2006 on November 07, 2009, 02:54:20 pm
Oh wow!! Brilliant! Didn't think it'd be finished so soon!
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Sauragnmon on November 07, 2009, 03:54:34 pm
That is absolutely seven shades of awesome.  Seriously, man.
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: Ed S on November 07, 2009, 04:14:57 pm
Looks good.  I like the spinning props.  Very nicely done.
 :thumbsup:

Ed
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on November 07, 2009, 04:24:59 pm
I'm back from adelaide and have (had, back to work tomorrow) a weeks leave (to gather what little shreds of my sanity remain) hence the F14K(itty) and i have finished this.
It was in paint when i left adelaide i just touched up a bit and decaled once i got home (this also explains some of the more dodgy bits of the build as i didn't have all my usual tools and equipment) of course i only photographed the best bits :wacko: :wacko:. I took the opportunity to practice washing techniques on this one (gundam markers are pretty cool and you can just draw panel lines where previously there were none but the bleed slightly under dullcote and the don't come off with acrylic thinners meaning mistakes can be hard to fix).

I also tested my patience and the properties of Mr Mark softer to the utmost with the decals from the academy kit which have incredibly thick film and don't conform well to panel lines (especially ones as badly re-scribed as mine  ;D ). this thick film can still be seen on the wings around the white stars, US star n' bars with the bars cut off, thankfully the blue is a perfect match for the citadel deadly night shade used on the upper surface.) The Chilean markings on the fuselage and the numbers are from a hawker hunter sheet i believe and went on much better.

I really like the shot with one engine run up. the kit only had two propellers (strangely enough being a twin engined plane ;D ) so to make one  a contra prop i had to use both. the spinning prop discs were the most expensive part of the build costing $120 (they did come with a free mobile broadband modem though  ;D ). I drew some hatch marks on the discs with grey gundam marker to give the impression of spinning props as well.  the eagal eyed amongst you may notice that both props pitch the same way thats cone one is set in full reverse pitch to provide resistance for engine running tests (when modeling skill fails write it into the backstory :wacko: )

you can't really see in the photos (crap transparencies don't help) but there is some equipment in teh clear nose. It is actually random bits of white metal mech as the model turned into something of a tail sitter ;D

thanks for all the positive responses. I havn't shown my wife yet, she doesn't build models or anything but has a JMN like eye for the slightest flaw and takes great delight in pointing  them out to me ;D
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: puddingwrestler on November 08, 2009, 03:00:47 am
Citadel Deadly Nightshade? You are showing your age there boyo; that was phased out three paint ranges ago!
But then again, Citadel have a history of phasing out perfectly excellent colours with no rhyme or reason (exits muttering about chestnut ink)
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: DaFROG on November 08, 2009, 03:06:58 am
it's in perfect condition. The old style lid as of course lost th tab and hinge necessitating the use of a bottle opener but the paint is fine (which is more than i can say for some of the newer citadel paints i have been using)
Title: Re: Whiffing away from home or consolidated model 35 in chillean service
Post by: sideshowbob9 on November 09, 2009, 03:52:16 am
The finished product is awesome!  :thumbsup: