What if

General Modelling Forum => General Modeling topics => The Idea Bank => Topic started by: Mossie on September 15, 2006, 08:32:15 am

Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Mossie on September 15, 2006, 08:32:15 am
I mentioned in another thread that I'd post some images of Avro concepts that I had in the AFM X-Plane special publications, so here you go, enjoy!  They were doing the rounds late 90's.

Also see this link that Chuck provided in the other thread, some other images as well as some three view:

http://www.aeronautics.ru/archive/future/uavs.htm (http://www.aeronautics.ru/archive/future/uavs.htm)

Firstly, UCAV's:

Unknown UCAV concept

Avenger VTOL Naval UCAV

Archangel UCAV, possibly a contender for FOAS

Another image of Archangel

Several more coming up, I'll post them in batches.

Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Mossie on September 15, 2006, 08:42:26 am
FOAS Concepts:

Mixed manned/unmanned combination

Another manned/unmanned combination

FOAS-1, a manned/unmanned combination using like aircraft.  One of my favourites this one, gorgeous painting.  Notice 617 Sqn markings, in a naval support role, also the stealth carrier & assault ship, other projects of theirs.

Strike version of Eurofighter (not named Typhoon by then, don't ask me why Avpro was mooting it)

Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Mossie on September 15, 2006, 08:49:30 am
Future Carrier Based Aircraft (FCAB) & fighter concepts:

Rapier FSW fighter

Marauder wing-hulled concept.  I like the 'beefy' look of this one!

JSF 'alternative'.  Looks very like the F-35 to me.

Royal Navy FCBA concept

Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Mossie on September 15, 2006, 08:53:46 am
Russian concepts (not sure what Avpro were thinking here, the new politcal situation must have gone to their heads!):

Russian convertiplane concept

Russian bomber concept.  I love the engine configuration on this one!

Another Russian bomber concept

Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Mossie on September 15, 2006, 09:08:05 am
Other manufacturers designs:

The way my scanner works you've got to do a page of a book at a time & thes got caught up so I included them for the hell of it!

Lockheed Martin UCAV concept

Eurofighter with conformal fuel tanks. Contender for FOAS

Boeing UCAV concept.  Looks remarkably like Bird of Prey, before that aircraft was released to the public.

BAe UCAV concept.  Pretty sure anyway, although it looks pretty similar to Avpros UCAV-2 concept.

Sorry if all these images have slowed down any steam powered computers, but I hope you all enjoy or even get some inspiration out of them.

Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: ysi_maniac on September 15, 2006, 09:28:43 am
Very interesting. :)  :)
I do not like UCAVs or stealth aircraft, but Typhies and Russians are really inspiring.

 :wub:  :wub:  :wub:
Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: B777LR on September 15, 2006, 10:17:07 am
Lockheed martin is currently studying an unmanned version of the F-35
Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: joncarrfarrelly on September 15, 2006, 10:31:22 am

Lockheed Martin UCAV concept

Boeing UCAV concept.  Looks remarkably like Bird of Prey, before that aircraft was released to the public.

The Lockheed is the Sabre Warrior, here's a LINK to a Quicktime video:
Sabre Warrior (http://www.lockheedmartin.com/wms/findAsset.do?ai=7054&dsp=fa)

The Boeing is the X-45:




Cheers, Jon
Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: GTX on September 15, 2006, 01:03:11 pm
If you want to see more of the AVPRO concepts try the following books:

"Warplanes of the Future (http://www.amazon.com/Warplanes-Future-David-Oliver/dp/1840650850/sr=1-2/qid=1158349909/ref=sr_1_2/104-2202113-3770356?ie=UTF8&s=books)" by David Oliver and Mike Ryan (former CEO of AVPRO)
"X-planes (http://www.amazon.com/X-planes-David-Oliver/dp/0004724615/sr=1-19/qid=1158350033/ref=sr_1_19/104-2202113-3770356?ie=UTF8&s=books)" by David Oliver and Mike Ryan

They also had a CD of their concepts available - if you ever get your hands on one please let me know.



Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Son of Damian on September 15, 2006, 03:32:09 pm
"Warplanes of the Future" by David Oliver and Mike Ryan
I have that one it's a pretty good book.

Anyways I personnally don't think that any AF will go entirely UCAV, I for see a single pilot controling a flight of 3/4 UCAVs cuz it's alwasy nice to have the redundency of a human.    
Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Freightdog862 on September 15, 2006, 03:44:35 pm
Never really understood the purpose of Avpro, but they used to have a good website (long gone, which didn't really explain what they were either). In my local aviation museum (Vallance collection at Gatwick Airport), tucked away in with the engine collection is the dusty 'Exint' rescue pod mock up shown hung on a Harrier GR-5 in the book (one of there only projects to make full scale mock up?), interesting project, at least I hope its a mock up as its made of plywood, you might prefer to take your chance with the enemy rather than climb in that!!
Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: amsci99 on September 16, 2006, 11:41:43 am
What ever happened to Avpro, nothing was heard of them after their site went down. It was never explained if these were illustrations relating to concept studies commissioned by the Ministry of Defence.
Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: jamakni on September 17, 2006, 03:45:12 pm
Any one have pictures of their "Super Frog"?  Just like the Russian Jet/helicopter.  It looks like a cross between a C-17 and a B-2.  Had a book form Avpro about concepts.  Was probably a fundraser for them.  Couldnt find it on my last trip home.
Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: RP1 on September 17, 2006, 04:58:42 pm
The Soviet Bomber concepts were real.  They are in Buttler and Gordon.  Myasichev M-20-9 and M-20-14.  They were featured in an AFM special on secret projects, so may have been commissioned for the mag.

Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Mossie on September 18, 2006, 07:09:58 am
Good reponse over the weekend!  I was hoping to be able to repsond then as I've just bought a brand new home computer (these messages are being brought to you courtesy of the University of Hull, i.e. I'm skiveing work to be on the forum!) but I've got to wait a week because of the way the telephones are where I live.

Cheers John, I knew I'd seen the X-45 somewhere before but couldn't remember!  I'd seen another rendering of the Sabre Warrior in manned configuration but that's all I knew about it, thanks for the info.

Avpro just seemed to dissappear.  I think most of their concepts where privately run, hoping someone would take notice, rather than any official tender to an OR.  Their dissapearance seems to suggest they either went bust, or more likely they were absorbed into another company like QinetiQ or BAE.  Often these small technolgy firms are set up by venture capital companies, rather than having any dedicated manufacturing they try to astound the industry, then hope someone tries to buy them & they're concepts for a nice tidy sum.

The other possibility is that they dissapeared into the 'black' world & we'll see some of their technology in whatever becomes of FOAS.  In the US maybe, but not old Blighty!

On another thread, Darren posted this about the EXINT Pod (http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles/1998/09/23/43106/UK+test+fits+Avpro+Exint+pod+on+Harrier.html).  It was planned to be fitted to Harriers & combat helicopters to insert & extract small special forces teams or evacuate casualties or downed aircrew.  It was thought that a comabat aircraft may offer advantages over a conventional transport helicopter when landing 'hot'.  I think there was also talk of a pure insertion variant that would be parachute dropped from a fixed wing aircraft!  Rather Johnny SAS than me!!!

Title: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Mossie on November 06, 2006, 06:28:06 am
Given a bump up!
Title: Re: Avpro Concepts
Post by: KJ_Lesnick on July 21, 2019, 09:27:47 pm
Other than the Russian designs, were any of the other concepts that were taken seriously as possible developments, or were they kind of just sketches that never went anywhere?
Title: Re: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Weaver on July 21, 2019, 09:45:47 pm
Just vapourware that never got anywhere for the most part.

The EXINT pod got as far as a mockup, and allegedly Israeli Special Forces bought a handful to use on Apaches, but take that info with a BIG pinch of salt.

Ranchoth's Arsenal on Shapeways makes 3D -printed models of them: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/ranchoth?li=pb
Title: Re: Avpro Concepts
Post by: Mossie on July 22, 2019, 12:48:05 am
There was a little more, the Proteus missile was also mocked up.  The stealth  trimaran aircraft carrier was officially submitted for the Royal Navy's CVF competition, it was rejected early on.

I feel that Avpro tried to be a serious concern, but were a minnow in a pond of pike, they were unlikely to last long.