What if

Hi, and welcome to my first thread on What If Modelers!

By way of a bit of background, I've recently offloaded my entire stash of 1/72 aircraft kits and decided on a re-boot in 1/48, the intention being Fewer Builds=More Completed. Good in theory, eh?  ;D  The two subjects of this double build were already on my 1/72 radar, but didn't come to fruition, so I thought it would be a good point to kick off in the larger scale.

The kits are from the Eduard "The Few" Dual Combo. One will be finished as a real aircraft, P9331, the PR Type B that force-landed at Reims in 1940 and was captured there by the advancing Wehrmacht. The second will be the what-if, a fairly simple paint job for a Vichy French Spitfire Mk.I ostensibly based in North Africa late-1941/early-1942.

The premise for the French aircaft is quite plausible: in 1938, a Major Jullerot of L'Armee de l'Air had an interview with the French Secretary of State for Aviation, with aim of interesting the French Government in acquiring Spitfires, an idea that was apparently received very favourably. An order for 100 Spitfires was considered but, at that stage, Supermarine were committed to deliver the first 300 to the RAF. In the end one example, the 251st aircraft built, was sold to France, arriving there on the 18th July 1939.

From here on, we deviate from history as we know it.....

Backstory
Spitfires for France didn't stop there, however. Major Jullerot, as obtaining Spitfires had been his idea, was tasked with acquiring a further 49 complete aircraft from Supermarine, and at the same time negotiating an initial production licence to manufacture 250 fighters in France. At the same time, he negotiated with Rolls-Royce for a licence to manufacture of the Merlin III to power the French-built aircraft. The licences were signed in late-August and mid-September 1939, following which Major Jullerot wasted no time in beginning organisation of production facilities and supplies. SNCASE were given the manufacturing contract.

The 49 Supermarine-built aircraft were delivered in January 1940, but domestic airframe production did not begin until early in March 1940; the French-built Merlin engines did not begin arriving until late in April. As it was, by the time the Battle of France erupted on 10th May 1940, fewer than 35 Spitfires had been formally accepted by L'Armee de l'Air. The remaining Supermarine aircraft and some 23 complete SNCASE-built examples had been accepted by the time of the Armistice on 25th June. Of the total of 73 Spitfires that had been available to the French air force, 27 had been lost to enemy action both in the air and on the ground: unsurprisingly, these were almost entirely from the Supermarine batch. Of the remaining 46, a further seven were deemed unserviceable, and were burned by their ground crews during the retreat southward into the unoccupied zone.

The surviving 39 aircraft, joined by six machines that had been at the SNCASE factory awaiting acceptance, made the journey across the Mediterranean to French North Africa where they joined L'Armee de l'Air de l'Armistice. Spares were understandably limited, and there were never enough serviceable Spitfires to equip more than two escadrilles de chasse. However, they proved very tough opponents during the Allies' Operation Torch amphibious landings, accounting for the majority of British and American aircraft lost; those still remaining airworthy after Torch were taken over by the RAF Desert Airforce.

Back to reality, attached are a few pics of the Eduard boxing that I'll be using. I've never built an Eduard Spit before, but have heard great things of them. I'm hoping to make a start in earnest at the weekend!

Thanks for looking in and all the best,
Mark

With that sort of backstory writing ability you'll fit right in here, no problem.  :thumbsup:

Welcome to this den of iniquity, nice to see you.

Welcome aboard, looking forward to the builds  :thumbsup:

Welcome to Whiffworld!  It's obvious from your first backstory that you belong here.

Quote from: PR19_Kit on May 03, 2023, 05:56:55 AMWith that sort of backstory writing ability you'll fit right in here, no problem.  :thumbsup:

Welcome to this den of iniquity, nice to see you.

Quote from: NARSES2 on May 03, 2023, 06:01:43 AMWelcome aboard, looking forward to the builds  :thumbsup:

Quote from: Rheged on May 03, 2023, 06:02:58 AMWelcome to Whiffworld!  It's obvious from your first backstory that you belong here.

Thanks, guys, its greatly appreciated!  ;D Hope the builds live up to the preamble!

Cheers,
Mark

Full agreement with the esteemed gentlemen above! ;D

Welcome aboard the Crazy Train, Mark! :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:

Quote from: Old Wombat on May 03, 2023, 06:34:14 AMFull agreement with the esteemed gentlemen above! ;D

Welcome aboard the Crazy Train, Mark! :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:

Many thanks! Glad to be on board  :thumbsup:

Cheers,
Mark

Welcome! I did enjoy that backstory!

Quote from: SPINNERS on May 03, 2023, 07:11:10 AMWelcome! I did enjoy that backstory!

Many thanks! Hope the finished article lives up to the hype  ;D

Cheers,
Mark

Quote from: 2996 Victor on May 03, 2023, 05:00:21 AMI've recently offloaded my entire stash of 1/72 aircraft kits and decided on a re-boot in 1/48, the intention being Fewer Builds=More Completed. Good in theory, eh?  ;D

Yeah, because I complete so many more models in 1:35 than I ever would be able to in 1:72 ... :rolleyes:

I don't know what it is, but I have a nagging suspicion you got something the wrong way round there ;)

The doors to the nuthouse opened...Mark stepped thru..the doors slammed shut.
Welcome matey  ;D 
Oh helpful hint...if you think your wiff is a bit to strange..it's quite possible it isn't in here 😉

Quote from: Jakko on May 03, 2023, 10:59:13 AM

Quote from: 2996 Victor on May 03, 2023, 05:00:21 AMI've recently offloaded my entire stash of 1/72 aircraft kits and decided on a re-boot in 1/48, the intention being Fewer Builds=More Completed. Good in theory, eh?  ;D

Yeah, because I complete so many more models in 1:35 than I ever would be able to in 1:72 ... :rolleyes:

I don't know what it is, but I have a nagging suspicion you got something the wrong way round there ;)

Hmmmm.....I think you're right  :laugh:  just don't tell my better half!

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 03, 2023, 12:45:26 PMThe doors to the nuthouse opened...Mark stepped thru..the doors slammed shut.
Welcome matey  ;D 
Oh helpful hint...if you think your wiff is a bit to strange..it's quite possible it isn't in here 😉

Aaagggghhhhh! Trapped! Oh, well - I think I'll probably fit in if I don't draw too much attention to myself  ;)

Thanks, guys!
Mark

Quote from: 2996 Victor on May 03, 2023, 11:52:14 PM

Quote from: Jakko on May 03, 2023, 10:59:13 AM

Quote from: 2996 Victor on May 03, 2023, 05:00:21 AMI've recently offloaded my entire stash of 1/72 aircraft kits and decided on a re-boot in 1/48, the intention being Fewer Builds=More Completed. Good in theory, eh?  ;D

Yeah, because I complete so many more models in 1:35 than I ever would be able to in 1:72 ... :rolleyes:

I don't know what it is, but I have a nagging suspicion you got something the wrong way round there ;)

Hmmmm.....I think you're right  :laugh:  just don't tell my better half!

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 03, 2023, 12:45:26 PMThe doors to the nuthouse opened...Mark stepped thru..the doors slammed shut.
Welcome matey  ;D 
Oh helpful hint...if you think your wiff is a bit to strange..it's quite possible it isn't in here 😉

Aaagggghhhhh! Trapped! Oh, well - I think I'll probably fit in if I don't draw too much attention to myself  ;)

Thanks, guys!
Mark

Dude your gonna fit in here with this raging pack of maniacs if you draw attention to yourself or not..come to think of it drawing attention to yourself is a good thing as there's a couple of guys here who will hunt you down if ya don't 😉  :wacko:
In all truth tho matey your gonna love it here ..a place where everybody is awesome and none will ever tear you a new one cause a rivet is .0274 of a mm out of place .
We hunt them ppl down here..its epic fun..once Chris (NARSES 2 ) says it's OK 👍

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 04, 2023, 12:07:01 AMDude your gonna fit in here with this raging pack of maniacs if you draw attention to yourself or not..come to think of it drawing attention to yourself is a good thing as there's a couple of guys here who will hunt you down if ya don't 😉  :wacko:
In all truth tho matey your gonna love it here ..a place where everybody is awesome and none will ever tear you a new one cause a rivet is .0274 of a mm out of place .
We hunt them ppl down here..its epic fun..once Chris (NARSES 2 ) says it's OK 👍

Thanks - that's a relief, although I'm not keen on the idea of being hunted down  :lol:  I wouldn't class myself as a rivet counter, so I guess I'm safe. At least for now  ;D

Cheers,
Mark

 ;D  ;D  ;D...your openly building a wiff..your safe matey 👍
It's nice knowing that what ever you build here is that your not wrong..I think the No1 unwritten rule here is that there are no rules 😉

^^^^^^^^^^^^^ :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 04, 2023, 01:03:01 PM;D  ;D  ;D...your openly building a wiff..your safe matey 👍
It's nice knowing that what ever you build here is that your not wrong..I think the No1 unwritten rule here is that there are no rules 😉

That's true - its quite refreshing to not "have" to worry about getting things spot-on in case someone starts picking it to pieces! And I've already got ideas for Whif #2 and Whif#3!  ;D

Cheers,
Mark

Except in GBs, we have rules for them ...Except Rule 6, we don't mention Rule 6! :blink:

Quote from: 2996 Victor on May 05, 2023, 12:04:57 AM

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 04, 2023, 01:03:01 PM;D  ;D  ;D...your openly building a wiff..your safe matey 👍
It's nice knowing that what ever you build here is that your not wrong..I think the No1 unwritten rule here is that there are no rules 😉

That's true - its quite refreshing to not "have" to worry about getting things spot-on in case someone starts picking it to pieces! And I've already got ideas for Whif #2 and Whif#3!  ;D

Cheers,
Mark

Mark mate ??? Two or three ??? ..ok your a noobie so it's OK 👍  :wacko:
When the addiction really bites mate your gonna have at least 10 bouncing around ya noggin ...ive got I think at least 15 and I'll bet more will pop in at some point 😀
Annoyingly I was trying to keep the numbers down and that failed miserably..came up with 2 more last week 😪 😫
But ill get over it 😄

Quote from: Old Wombat on May 05, 2023, 12:50:46 AMExcept in GBs, we have rules for them ...Except Rule 6, we don't mention Rule 6! :blink:

Ahh Guy me good mate those are written rules except for the one between 5 and 7 of course..im to afraid to mention that number..scared of the consequences it might bring 😟🥺

Quote from: Old Wombat on May 05, 2023, 12:50:46 AMExcept in GBs, we have rules for them ...Except Rule 6, we don't mention Rule 6! :blink:

Okay, as a newbie, I'm bound to ask, what is Rule Siiiii......Five (a)?

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 05, 2023, 12:55:13 AM

Quote from: 2996 Victor on May 05, 2023, 12:04:57 AM

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 04, 2023, 01:03:01 PM;D  ;D  ;D...your openly building a wiff..your safe matey 👍
It's nice knowing that what ever you build here is that your not wrong..I think the No1 unwritten rule here is that there are no rules 😉

That's true - its quite refreshing to not "have" to worry about getting things spot-on in case someone starts picking it to pieces! And I've already got ideas for Whif #2 and Whif#3!  ;D

Cheers,
Mark

Mark mate ??? Two or three ??? ..ok your a noobie so it's OK 👍  :wacko:
When the addiction really bites mate your gonna have at least 10 bouncing around ya noggin ...ive got I think at least 15 and I'll bet more will pop in at some point 😀
Annoyingly I was trying to keep the numbers down and that failed miserably..came up with 2 more last week 😪 😫
But ill get over it 😄

I do need to try and keep things sensible  :rolleyes:  as I've got plenty of real-world builds planned as well!

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 05, 2023, 12:58:42 AM

Quote from: Old Wombat on May 05, 2023, 12:50:46 AMExcept in GBs, we have rules for them ...Except Rule 6, we don't mention Rule 6! :blink:

Ahh Guy me good mate those are written rules except for the one between 5 and 7 of course..im to afraid to mention that number..scared of the consequences it might bring 😟🥺

Still curious  ;)

Cheers,
Mark

Mate play it safe ..your friends and family love and need you so please never ever ask about the number between 5 and 7 ..it's like a gateway to hell or some alternative reality-based nightmare  where everybody is forced to eat only tofu based food products and drive only electric cars made in russia...so I've been told ..ive never asked about that number ..I never will 😵�💫
I don't like tofu 😐 quite fond of Burger King though 😋
Just keep repeating to yourself.."there's no such thing as Rule ₩₩₩"
 :thumbsup:  ;D
Honestly I have no idea why we don't ask about rule 6 ..it's just one of the weird and wonderful things about this place  <_<

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 05, 2023, 03:09:34 AMMate play it safe ..your friends and family love and need you so please never ever ask about the number between 5 and 7 ..it's like a gateway to hell or some alternative reality-based nightmare  where everybody is forced to eat only tofu based food products and drive only electric cars made in russia...so I've been told ..ive never asked about that number ..I never will 😵�💫
I don't like tofu 😐 quite fond of Burger King though 😋
Just keep repeating to yourself.."there's no such thing as Rule ₩₩₩"
 :thumbsup:  ;D
Honestly I have no idea why we don't ask about rule 6 ..it's just one of the weird and wonderful things about this place  <_<

My :-X ! I'm never mentioning it again - tofu and electric cars give me the heebie jeebies and the idea of an eternity of either would be enough to make me turn to drink (if I hadn't already)  :drink:  (Actually, Guy @Old Wombat has PM'd me the explanation  <_< perhaps you could share the secret, Guy?)

Cheers  :cheers:
Mark

😆 🤣...with all the yrs I've been here no one had ever told me about rule 6 ...but then again I've never asked so  that could be the reason 🙃 

I used to have a friend who was a girl who ate tofu burgers and she'd give me crap when I'd dig into a double whopper with cheese 😅 oh with extra mayo and ketchup  😀

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 05, 2023, 03:40:05 AM😆 🤣...with all the yrs I've been here no one had ever told me about rule 6 ...but then again I've never asked so  that could be the reason 🙃 

I used to have a friend who was a girl who ate tofu burgers and she'd give me crap when I'd dig into a double whopper with cheese 😅 oh with extra mayo and ketchup  😀

That's hilarious, makes me chuckle  <_<  I can't imagine what a tofu burger tastes like, but I know tofu is bean curd and that's enough to put me off  :wacko:

😀😀😀  ..I don't know what that stuff tastes like either even tho I've tried it ..if it wasn't for the flavors put on it I bet I wouldn't have tasted it even tho I ate it 🤪 .

Welcome aboard, Vic! :mellow:

Quote from: 2996 Victor on May 05, 2023, 12:32:38 PM

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 05, 2023, 03:40:05 AM😆 🤣...with all the yrs I've been here no one had ever told me about rule 6 ...but then again I've never asked so  that could be the reason 🙃 

I used to have a friend who was a girl who ate tofu burgers and she'd give me crap when I'd dig into a double whopper with cheese 😅 oh with extra mayo and ketchup  😀

That's hilarious, makes me chuckle  <_<  I can't imagine what a tofu burger tastes like, but I know tofu is bean curd and that's enough to put me off  :wacko:

 ;D  I'm far from vegan or vegetarian, most of my main meals include some sort of meat and, although my wife is fully vegan, i haven't ate tofu burgers yet... i do have some soja ones and i can say that they're pretty good, obviously not meat but, to me they taste good so, i have a couple of fat ones from time to time. They're even better with some cheese and mayo for sure... ;D

Well I just enjoyed a Hawaiian pizza and a garlic bread with a ice cold can of V energy drink and there wasn't a single bit of tofu anywhere 😅
As for the vegetarian vegan thing ..well nope ..I'll admit I did have a vegetarian pie and it was damn good ..a Ron of taste..this was at a dinner party at a friend's place ..great tasting food but nowhere enough of it ..so I had Wendy's Burgers on the way home 😋

Oh Mark one thing you might have figured out by now or you might not have but we can go off topic in a heart beat around here and it's normally a good laugh or very insightful 😄
Don't worry tho..we do get back to it ...eventually 🙃

Guys,
sorry I haven't responded sooner - we had a little shindig going on in the UK yesterday  ;) and a few too many drinkies celebrating our new Monarch's coronation  &lt;_&lt;

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 05, 2023, 01:04:56 PM😀😀😀  ..I don't know what that stuff tastes like either even tho I've tried it ..if it wasn't for the flavors put on it I bet I wouldn't have tasted it even tho I ate it 🤪 .

;D  ;D  ;D it really sounds revolting, even the name sounds like someone just sneezed!!!  :wacko:

Quote from: DogfighterZen on May 06, 2023, 12:02:26 AM;D  I'm far from vegan or vegetarian, most of my main meals include some sort of meat and, although my wife is fully vegan, i haven't ate tofu burgers yet... i do have some soja ones and i can say that they're pretty good, obviously not meat but, to me they taste good so, i have a couple of fat ones from time to time. They're even better with some cheese and mayo for sure... ;D

I tried soya milk in my tea once, it was foul, almost enough to put me off soya products for life! Seriously, though, it has its uses but I have to wonder why people profess to be vegetarian/vegan and then crave plant-based "meat". There were TV adverts for "the Vegetarian Butcher" recently, as you can imagine, plant-based meat substitutes. But, IMHO, you don't "butcher" vegetables, you peel 'em!  ;D  ;D  ;D

Quote from: Wardukw-NZ on May 06, 2023, 02:58:47 AMWell I just enjoyed a Hawaiian pizza and a garlic bread with a ice cold can of V energy drink and there wasn't a single bit of tofu anywhere 😅
As for the vegetarian vegan thing ..well nope ..I'll admit I did have a vegetarian pie and it was damn good ..a Ron of taste..this was at a dinner party at a friend's place ..great tasting food but nowhere enough of it ..so I had Wendy's Burgers on the way home 😋

Oh Mark one thing you might have figured out by now or you might not have but we can go off topic in a heart beat around here and it's normally a good laugh or very insightful 😄
Don't worry tho..we do get back to it ...eventually 🙃

Love it! We've been known to go for dinner at friends' houses, and stop off for a cheeky Maccie D's on the way home  :laugh: Nothing wrong with vegetable recipes, I love a veggie lasagne f'rinstance, and Hawaiian pizzas, jacket spuds with baked beans, etc etc. Never going to give up a bacon sarnie, though! Nope. Not ever!
Oh, and a bit of light-hearted thread drift is all good fun  ;)  ;)  ;)

Cheers,
Mark

Quote from: 2996 Victor on May 07, 2023, 03:52:46 AMSeriously, though, it has its uses but I have to wonder why people profess to be vegetarian/vegan and then crave plant-based "meat".

Well, it's simple, due to the fact that most people grow up eating meat and when they turn vegetarian/vegan for whatever reasons they have, the flavour and texture of meat is what most people miss the most. At least i know that's what i'd miss if i tried... All i say is that i respect every choice as long as my choice is also respected so, to each their own, right? I have never even seriously considered turning vegan or even vegetarian and still, my wife will only go as far as eating a couple of eggs from time to time so, if everyone in this world could respect each other instead of arguing and trying to tell others what they should do or eat, things would be so much easier for everyone...
Might as well post this to keep from writing something similar...  :rolleyes:  ;D  :thumbsup:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugrAo8wEPiI

Now, let's have some styrene in this thread, shall we?  :mellow:

Quote from: DogfighterZen on May 07, 2023, 08:09:35 AMAll i say is that i respect every choice as long as my choice is also respected so, to each their own, right?

Absolutely!

Quote from: DogfighterZen on May 07, 2023, 08:09:35 AMNow, let's have some styrene in this thread, shall we?  :mellow:

Soon!

Cheers,
Mark ;)

So at long last I've been making some headway on these two birds.

At the moment, I'm more-or-less building in parallel, and over the weekend I've concentrated on the cockpits. The Vichy What-if is slightly farther ahead at close of play as I've sprayed the interior colours while the Real World PR Type B is still in primer. The latter is because Supermarine used their own interior green on Mk.I Spitfires, and I miscalculated the quantities of paint I had available for mixing it!

The French bird has its interior in typical Armee de l'Air colours of blue and chamois. The blue is perhaps a little light and bright (its less intense in real life), but once its had a matt coat and the fuselage is closed up, I think it'll be fine. Detail painting is up next and then adding the legion of separate greeblies that Eduard supply.

Thanks for stopping by!

Cheers,
Mark

Nice progress  :thumbsup:

Quote from: NARSES2 on May 22, 2023, 06:02:32 AMNice progress  :thumbsup:

Thanks :thumbsup: more soon (I hope!)

Well now, almost ten months later and here we are again!

What's been happening in the meantime? B'all, to be honest - several RW builds started and stalled as the old mojo rides its rollercoaster of peaks and troughs  <_< The PR Type B hasn't progressed much, if at all, while our What-if Vichy took, if anything, several rearward steps. The fuselage was appropriated for a possible Speed Spitfire build and all the interior paint washed off, and the remaining cockpit parts languished/got damaged/got lost etc etc.

This brings us to the last couple of weeks when this little project has awoken. A spare set of fuselage halves have been snipped from their sprues and had their tub halves fitted, and these and the remaining and replacement cockpit frames, seat and bulkheads have had a coat of blue, this time Tamiya XF-8, with the rear fuselage again being painted chamois.

Next job is to bring the cockpit to life with its various details and a few greebles.

Thanks for looking in!

Cheers,
Mark

Progress is progress  :thumbsup:

Mini update to show I've been doing a bit to the "office" with Quinta Studio's 3D-printed decals and some bits and pieces of copper and lead wire. There are a few more odds and ends still to add before I finally close up the fuselage!

Thanks for looking in!
Mark

Cockpit's looking good  :thumbsup:

Quote from: NARSES2 on April 09, 2024, 05:49:48 AMCockpit's looking good  :thumbsup:

Thanks - it's getting there at long last!  &lt;_&lt;