What if the Germans had shared with the Japanese the technology of the Horten 229 flying wing fighter?
Now you can find out as I build the 1/72 scale Revell Horten 229 into a what if Japanese Horten 229. :thumbsup:
I don't know a hill of beans when it comes to Japanese aircraft, markings, paint schemes, etc. So if I screw something up and it looks wrong, then too bad. It's a whif, so anything goes. ;) I had asked about the wheel well and landing gear door color here:
http://www.whatifmodellers.com/index.php/topic,44280.0.html
Since I'm broke and can't afford to buy new bottles of paint right now, I had to use whatever was already available to me. Therefore, the wheel wells and landing gear door interiors got painted Tamiya X-14 Sky Blue. The color for the underside of the aircraft will be Testor Acryl Light Grey. Top aircraft color might be Olive Drab, though I'm not sure yet.
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I'm looking forward to this :thumbsup:
nice start
Quote from: comrade harps on September 21, 2017, 11:41:18 PM
I'm looking forward to this :thumbsup:
Me to plus it's got me thinking :thumbsup:
:thumbsup:
Quote from: seadude on September 22, 2017, 07:13:19 AM
Quote from: NARSES2 on September 22, 2017, 06:00:46 AM
Quote from: comrade harps on September 21, 2017, 11:41:18 PM
I'm looking forward to this :thumbsup:
Me to plus it's got me thinking :thumbsup:
Oh? Thinking about what?
I've a couple of German Flying Wing type projects in the resin part of the stash and one of those might suit Japanese markings. Hadn't thought of it before, so thank you :thumbsup:
A few more pics. The "depression" at the back of the engine exhaust area is painted Testor Acryl Jet Exhaust color. The rest of the area behind that is painted Testor Acryl Steel. The yellow wing leading edges may look nice and bright, but that's only because of the effect of my camera flash, not because of how good or bad my painting is. The bottom of this model aircraft is getting painted Testor Acryl Light Grey. The top of the aircraft is getting painted Testor Acryl Olive Drab. I painted the guns and ammo boxes, but unfortuneately once they're inside and the upper and lower center fuselage sections are glued, you can't see them anymore..........unless you're a judge at a contest with a tiny mirror and flashlight. :wacko: There are access panels that cover both guns, but I might leave one of them open. I'm not sure yet.
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Few more pics. The cockpit, intakes, and engine exhaust areas in the pics might look like they were painted bluish, but they weren't. This was a side effect of my camera flash going off. Next thing to work on will be the landing gear........which I am not looking forward to. :banghead: Some of the parts are thin and fragile.
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Final pics to come tomorrow. Working on canopy and other final details tonight. The landing gear was a MAJOR pain in the ***. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: Especially the nose landing gear. Unfortuneately, when a person looks at my model from a head on view, the nose gear is "slightly" slanted toward the left side of the aircraft. :banghead:
Nice, I once build the prototype of it:
(https://www.whatifmodellers.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.german-navy.de%2Fweb%2FScaleModels%2FScaleModel20160102132918.jpg&hash=88a2f4941f0b6257ff8fb2d47d5bb438409cb57d)
http://www.whatifmodellers.com/index.php/topic,41654.0.html (http://www.whatifmodellers.com/index.php/topic,41654.0.html)
But this was made form the "great" PM-Models kit, with its 20 parts or so.
Ok, I'm calling this one done. :thumbsup: My biggest complaint about this kit was the landing gear, especially building the nose landing gear. :banghead: Trying to get the 3-4 different strut pieces properly attached was a real pain. Unfortuneately when you look at the front head on pics of the model, you'll see that my nose landing gear is "slightly" slanted. I tried to correct it as best I could, but........ :banghead:
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Looks great.
TomZ
A fascinating outcome. I'm impressed with both construction and original idea. Well done.
An excellent job, and very quickly done too. :thumbsup:
The fact that the nosewheel is on a slight slant is overwhelmed by the sheer SIZE of the thing, why ever did they make it so huge?
Quote from: PR19_Kit on September 27, 2017, 11:11:16 AM
An excellent job, and very quickly done too. :thumbsup:
The fact that the nosewheel is on a slight slant is overwhelmed by the sheer SIZE of the thing, why ever did they make it so huge?
Well, I guess if the Horten ever ditched in the ocean, the overly large nose gear tire could serve as a flotation device for the pilot. ;D ;D ;D (Just kidding.)
Equipment, operational requirements, and consequent weight, dictated the size, just as with
a regular aircraft.
Well yes, I appreciate that, but it does seem overly large, and it'd be interesting to know what those requirements etc. were.
Looking in side view, the two engines, presumably the heaviest part of the aircraft at that stage of aviation's evolution, were pretty well centrally located, and the main wheels were around the same distance aft of the engines as the nose wheel was forward of them. So that may be just one reason for such a large nosewheel, it had to take twice the load of the individual main wheels.
Oops, you were referring to just the nose wheel, not the airframe. So much for multi-tasking. :banghead:
The big wheel is unique to the V3 prototype in the Smithsonian, the V2 wheel was smaller, evidently the
change was made by Gotha without consulting the Horten's, Reimar posited it was to do with the projected
1,000kg bomb-load, however he didn't think the mod necessary.
Ok, that makes some sense too.
Is the one in the Smithsonian the only one left anywhere?
Quote from: PR19_Kit on September 27, 2017, 11:11:16 AM
An excellent job, and very quickly done too. :thumbsup:
The fact that the nosewheel is on a slight slant is overwhelmed by the sheer SIZE of the thing, why ever did they make it so huge?
It's obviously pre-planning for the extra weight of the long wing version ;D
I've used to wonder if the big forward gear was to give it a bit of a nose up attitude on the ground to perhaps help on the takeoff run and they decided on a big solid wheel instead of an extended gear leg.
Quote from: PR19_Kit on September 27, 2017, 03:14:07 PM
Ok, that makes some sense too.
Is the one in the Smithsonian the only one left anywhere?
Yep, four under construction prototypes V3 to V6 (two-seater) were found, the V3 was closest to completion,
about half done, so it was recovered, the wings were not recovered at the same time, they were found in a
village 121 km away, and those
might be the wings now with the V3 centre section. Evidently there is
no definite paper trail.
Just had an idea. :thumbsup: I don't think I've ever seen a model of a Soviet Ho-229? What if the Russians had captured one instead? Maybe someone else can do a whif of a Russian 229? :thumbsup:
Awesome Job on the 229 :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: You Really gave me the Impression it Was an Alternate History Acutal! Keep up the Superb Work :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: Dan
Big nose-wheel for soft, unprepared field operations? :unsure:
This BIG nosewheel was simply tailwheel from He-177 Greif .... in real....
Quote from: PantherG on September 28, 2017, 05:37:31 AM
This BIG nosewheel was simply tailwheel from He-177 Greif .... in real....
You learn something new every day, thanks so much for that PantherG. :thumbsup:
That's come out really well :thumbsup:
I forgot to ask this earlier, but what would have been the purpose of the two black parts (One on either side of the nose at the front leading edge.) on the leading edge of the model? They are parts that came with the kit and were shown in the instructions. Could they have been flash suppressors for when the guns were firing? What are they?
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This is awesome!!! I think it looks great..... better like this than the German liveries.
Quote from: seadude on September 28, 2017, 07:13:14 PM
I forgot to ask this earlier, but what would have been the purpose of the two black parts (One on either side of the nose at the front leading edge.) on the leading edge of the model? They are parts that came with the kit and were shown in the instructions. Could they have been flash suppressors for when the guns were firing? What are they?
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4332/37098504820_d1507a197a_b.jpg)
Hmmm..... good question.... (my post made a new page in the thread so I wanted to make sure this didn't get missed)
Jokingly.. they look like something to flip omelettes. Hazarding an actual guess... I'd suspect they were some type of or attached to some type of instrumentation. Truth of the matter is I have no idea.
QuoteHazarding an actual guess... I'd suspect they were some type of or attached to some type of instrumentation.
Maybe, but doubtful. Look at Steps 22 and 23 in the below instruction page. Step 22 shows the gun bays (and covers) on either side of the nose gear well. Step 23 shows the parts that I had mentioned fitting into the exit ports where the guns would be firing. So the parts must be related to the guns somehow, right?
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4388/36522038104_c48f81ab47_b.jpg)
Yeah... I would agree, for sure. Definitely to do with the guns since they are in the gun ports. hehe
Trying to wrap my mind around what would make sense there...
I now recall a story of an aircraft, may have been the B-25 when they mounted the guns on the side, that they had to put an extension on the barrel because the firing of those guns was damaging the fuselage. Looking at this one, perhaps they wanted to extend that concussive action past the intakes, which are very close by.
I was liking your theory of flash suppressant, too, though, I just can't see that being a good reason considering where this this thing fights and flies... hiding gun flame wouldn't be much of a priority up there... if anything, if they wanted to achieve stealth, they'd load up with ammunition that didn't contain tracer rounds.
I'd suggest they're muzzle brakes to reduce the recoil effects of the Rheinmetall‑Borsig 30mm MK 108 cannon they were designed to carry on the relatively light structure of the plane. The alignment, I think, should be vertical, rather than horizontal, as this would also send the ejected gasses above & below the wing instead of into the front of the wing & the intake. As none of the 3 Horten 229's built included weapons, it's probably a model design error.
These are/were muzzle brakes, but these are normally associated with the 30mm MK 103 cannon:
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Very different beast from the later, compact MK 108 which was widely used in late war fighters and attack aircraft, e. g. in the Me 262 or Me 163. The MK 103 was an earlier design, much bigger (esp. with a long barrel) and had much more range and firepower - it was, for instance, used against tanks as special equipment under some HS 129 or Bf 110. It was a good choice against bombers, too, but, IIRC, rare. Due to the much lower velocity of the MK 108 projectiles it would not need or carry muzzle brakes, so I'd assume that the model depicts OOB a Go 229 with two MK 103?
The sources I read said the Ho.229 was meant to be fitted with MK 108's but, I guess, MK 103's are just as viable. It is a whif-in-a-box after all is said & done. ;)
very nice - great concept
Quote from: Old Wombat on September 29, 2017, 12:42:58 AM
The sources I read said the Ho.229 was meant to be fitted with MK 108's but, I guess, MK 103's are just as viable. It is a whif-in-a-box after all is said & done. ;)
And it's Japanese so the guns can be whatever Seadude want's them to be ;) How about 40mm Ho 301's fitted with flash suppressors ?
You could stay with smaller calibres such as the Ho-155-I (or the later light-weight -II);
Quote from: wikipediaSpecifications (Ho-155-I)
Caliber: 30 mm (1.2 in)[2]
Ammunition: 30 x 114 (235 g)
Weight: 50 kg (110 lb)
Rate of fire: 450 rounds/min
Muzzle velocity: 700 m/s (2,300 ft/s)
Range: 900 m
or the Ho-204
Quote from: wikipediaSpecifications (Ho-204)
Caliber: 37 mm (1.45 in)
Ammunition: 37 x 144 (475 g)
Weight: 130 kg (285 lb)
Rate of fire: 400 rounds/min
Muzzle velocity: 710 m/s (2,330 ft/s)
Having had a quick read, I'm not sure the Ho-301 is a suitagle weapon - the Ho.229 may have ended up shooting itself down! :o
Here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ho-301_cannon (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ho-301_cannon)
Of the above weapons, I think the Ho-155-II would be the most suitable.
I'd love to get one and put it in USAF markings