avatar_GTX

He-177 and derivatives

Started by GTX, March 12, 2011, 02:37:47 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

jcf

Quote from: GTX on March 15, 2011, 01:42:29 AM
Quote from: The Wooksta! on March 13, 2011, 06:37:27 AM

An AWACS?  No, not enough space on board for all the radar gear and the operators.  There's a reason why most AWACS are converted airliners. 


For the era you would be looking, why not something akin to the Shackleton AEW.2?


... or perhaps a Wellington?  ;)

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=23065&mode=threaded&pid=252375

http://gregers.7.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=11045&sid=42ced955a7f97de3f8aa4534024fee61



"Conspiracy theory's got to be simple.
Sense doesn't come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated crap
actually is than they ever are about
whatever's supposed to be behind the
conspiracy."
-The Peripheral, William Gibson 2014

GTX

Thanks - forgot about them.

Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

The Wooksta!

Except the Wellington is a low/mid wing aircraft and designed with crew access from nose to tail so there's built in space for a couple of radar operators.  The 177 was a shoulder/mid wing and the rear isn't intended for crew access - the gun positions were accessed directly via a hatch underneath for the mid upper and the canopy for the tail.  There's no crew access from the cockpit to the rear - aft of the cockpit is full of fuel or bombs.

Had the Luftwaffe lasted long enough and gone down the AWACS route, it would most likely have been either a converted Condor, Ju 290 or Ju 352, possibly transport He 111s.  Oodles of space for black boxes and their operators and less tendency for the engines to burst into flames.
"It's basically a cure -  for not being an axe-wielding homicidal maniac. The potential market's enormous!"

"Visit Scarfolk today. Our number one priority is keeping rabies at bay"
https://scarfolk.blogspot.com/

"An inaccurate parcel of dog turds!"

The Plan:
www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic

Rheged

Quote from: Cobra on March 12, 2011, 04:59:42 PM
Sweet :thumbsup: how about an Air Sea Rescue Version? that work for you? Dan

At the risk of being cynical, at least you could use them for illuminating a wide sea area to allow others to search. Weren't they known as the "Reichslighter" ?  .......... or was it just the early versions caught fire ?
"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you....."
It  means that you read  the instruction sheet

The Wooksta!

No, pretty much all of them.
"It's basically a cure -  for not being an axe-wielding homicidal maniac. The potential market's enormous!"

"Visit Scarfolk today. Our number one priority is keeping rabies at bay"
https://scarfolk.blogspot.com/

"An inaccurate parcel of dog turds!"

The Plan:
www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic

Tuck

At one point, Designer Hertl (who did the initial design) returned to Heinkel to try to iron out the bugs.  They identified 40+ design modifications/corrections that would have alleviated much of the fire issue, but it was felt the modifications would disrupt the production lines too much.  Heinkel wanted to switch to 4 separate engines early on but they kept assuring him the twin coupled powerplants were on the verge of reliability (false).  The 177 was alot like the B-29, only in terms of innovative design.  The difference was that America worked tirelessly to resolve the bus of the B-29 whereas the Luftwaffe didn't.
"I do this hobby for fun not to be nitpicked, and that's one reason i love this place (What-If) so much, its not necessarily the quality, its the 'spirit' of the build or idea that's important..."-Beowulf

GTX

AEW Derivatives - both piston and turboprop:



Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

Taiidantomcat

Quote from: Tuck on March 16, 2011, 08:24:25 AM
At one point, Designer Hertl (who did the initial design) returned to Heinkel to try to iron out the bugs.  They identified 40+ design modifications/corrections that would have alleviated much of the fire issue, but it was felt the modifications would disrupt the production lines too much. 

We would not like to disrupt full production of our aircraft that doesn't work LOL
"Imagination is the one weapon in the war against reality." -Jules de Gaultier

"My model is right! It's the real world that's wrong!" -global warming scientist

An armor guy, who builds airplanes almost exclusively, that he converts to space fighters-- all while admiring ship models.

The Wooksta!

Yes. Impeccable Nazi logic. 
"It's basically a cure -  for not being an axe-wielding homicidal maniac. The potential market's enormous!"

"Visit Scarfolk today. Our number one priority is keeping rabies at bay"
https://scarfolk.blogspot.com/

"An inaccurate parcel of dog turds!"

The Plan:
www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic

rickshaw

Rather like the logic that decreed that the UK should keep producing 2 Pdr anti-tank guns well after their utility was questionable and should concentrate exclusively on Spitfires and Hurricanes over other, promising designs.  Then we have the debacle of the Manchester bomber.  The debacle of the Hereford bomber.  The debacle of the Albermarle bomber.  Remember, Voltair suggested that "the perfect is the enemy of the good".

The Nazis applied the same rationale - better to have some aircraft than none, just as the UK did in 1940.   Logically, it would have been better for them to have halted production, made modifications and then restarted it but that would have disrupted upstream production as well with consequent flow on effects.  Remember, when they decided to put the He177 into production, they were winning the war.  When its faults became apparent, they had started to lose it and they, in their opinion, needed every aircraft they could lay their hands on.   It was unfortunate for them that the faults were so bad that they couldn't fix them with either incremental changes (which they tried) or remanufacture (which they also tried).   It was fortunate for us, the Allies that was the case.  While the He177 wouldn't have won the war for the Nazis it would have prolonged it, allowing them to strike at targets considerably further away and have complicated the defence against them.

How to reduce carbon emissions - Tip #1 - Walk to the Bar for drinks.

Doc Yo

  Greg- Love the AEW profiles. If you don't mind, I'm going to borrow the concept for another manufacturer...

GTX

Quote from: Doc Yo on March 18, 2011, 07:02:09 AM
  Greg- Love the AEW profiles. If you don't mind, I'm going to borrow the concept for another manufacturer...

Go for it!

Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

GTX

Another one thrown together:



Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

Gary F

Greg,

  Nice one ... like the engines  :thumbsup:

Gary F

Taiidantomcat

"Imagination is the one weapon in the war against reality." -Jules de Gaultier

"My model is right! It's the real world that's wrong!" -global warming scientist

An armor guy, who builds airplanes almost exclusively, that he converts to space fighters-- all while admiring ship models.