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A-7 Corsair and F-8 Crusader

Started by upnorth, November 01, 2005, 02:28:49 AM

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retro_seventies

Good luck with this one - i've started one and it's looking at me accusingly from it's box whenever i open it, look at it, and put the lid back on.

i was thinking that when the inevitable MLU came round that it would be re-armed with 27mm mauser for commonality with the tornado (and consequently eurofighter and then JSF, because nobody would build a plane without a gun, obviously).

new radar, LERX and FBW controls, and re-engining would be a possibility, maybe a non afterburning rb199 (again, for commonality).

a whole stack of new bumps and lumps and blades for uplinks, designators and LLTV, and an in service life up to about 2015 or so.  Possibly keep a couple for FRADU after that.
"Computer games don't affect kids. I mean, if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music." Kristin Wilson, Nintendo Inc, 1989.

Mike Wren

#16
QuoteI think I'll stay with my idea of 5 sqn markings as I have them easily on hand. Anyway, last I heard (in reality) 5 sqn is out of the interceptor business and is planned to be the operator of a new bird called the R.1 Sentinel which I've heard is some sort of ECM bird based on the Canadair Challenger biz jet.
well it is designated 5 (Army Co-operation) Sqn, so ground attack wouldn't be out of the question even though they've mainly operated fighters... plus their badge is a maple leaf...  ;)

link

upnorth

I've decided to make a go of my plans for a RAF A-7 Corsair II (some of you may recall a recent posting I made about it).

Based on some comments in the previous thread, I'm going on the premise that the Sepecat Jaguar never came into being and a license built A-7 was the aircraft of choice for the role.

Actually the Jaguar did exist, but Britain pulled out of the project and left France to find a new partner for the project, eventually Fokker stepped in where BAC stepped out and the Jaguar had a very different history from the one we are familiar with. (Anyone wanting to pick up on that story line can feel free to do so, I can't see myself touching it :P )

Anyway, I'm in the very early stages of mods to it, here's some so far:

New cockpit; as there is little to the kit cockpit, I managed to find a resin Jaguar GR.1 pit cheap and it shouldn't be too difficult to tailor it to the A-7 using a few of the A-7 parts to get the width right.

Landing gear doors; after looking at photos of Jaguars, Harriers and a few non British strike aircraft; it seems there is a preference to keep as much of the landing gear bays covered against FOD as possible. I cut the gear doors a bit so that the largest sections of them would remain closed except on rotation.

Being as how this bird is going to be doing what the Jaguar would have done in RAF service, I think it best to load it out similarly to a Jag.

Does anyone know about the Airfix 1/72 Jaguar GR.3 kit? I know its a repop of their old GR.1 with a new weapons sprue that contains underwing countermeasures pods and British style Paveway bombs, but I don't know about their accuracy or quality. Is that kit a good source of those things?

I would be using the Jaguar kit's nose tip to make a TIALD unit for the A-7 and I also want to use the British flare and chaff boxes that I understand the Jaguar kit has.

I was thinking Paveway IIs on the inboard pylons, 1000 lb bombs on the mid wing pylons and the coutermeasures pods on the outer pylons.

I was also considering auxiliary tanks on the inboard pylons with 2 BL755s on TERs on the mid wing pylons and single BL755s on each outer pylon.

The weapons fit is a ways off yet, but I hope someone can tell if the Airfix Jaguar GR.3 is a good source of weapons for my A-7. I don't want to break the bank on a kit I'm just getting for parts.

I'm still open to suggestions about more "Anglifying" mods I can do around the fuselage and wings.

Thanks in advance.

lancer

Good luck with it. The Airfix Gr3/4 is a good source of weapons, as it has all the original stores plus the new spruces of weapons.
If you love, love without reservation; If you fight, fight without fear - THAT is the way of the warrior

If you go into battle knowing you will die, then you will live. If you go into battle hoping to live, then you will die

retro_seventies

when the harrier grew some lerx, maybe the corsair did too?

i have the airfix jag gr3 on my shelf at the moment - let me get my ancient scanner installed and fired up, and i'll scan sprues for you....
"Computer games don't affect kids. I mean, if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music." Kristin Wilson, Nintendo Inc, 1989.

elmayerle

AS a thought, use much the same LERX as the A-7F had if you want to depict a developed one.
"Reality is the leading cause of stress amongst those in touch with it."
--Jane Wagner and Lily Tomlin

Geoff_B

QuoteI would be using the Jaguar kit's nose tip to make a TIALD unit for the A-7 and I also want to use the British flare and chaff boxes that I understand the Jaguar kit has.

The Airfix Jag GR-3 kit has the new weapons sprue with Paveway II & III plus the TIALD pod. That should save you having to play with the actual Jag airframe too much.

Cheers

Geoff B

upnorth

Thanks for the suggestions, I'll keep an eye peeled for the Jaguar GR.3 kit on my LHS's shelves.

The idea of overwing sidewinders is tempting, but also perhaps a bit too unique to the Jaguar itself. I think I might try moving the Corsair's sidewinder pylons off the fuselage and onto the inboard side of the inboard weapon pylons, sort of the same thing that got done on Tornados and F-15s.

Damian2: Thanks for the invite to the group build you mentioned, but with a bunch of other things going on right now, this build will take a while. I think I'll just take my time and post pics here whenever she gets done.

The matter of the Airfix Jag kit having a TIALD pod brings a question: When did the TIALD pod came into use? Was it a complete replacement for the gear in the Jag's nose?

I'm thinking of placing my A-7 in a late 80s time frame, maybe just a year or two prior to Desert Storm/Granby operations. Is the TIALD pod appropriate to that time frame?

I have also thought about the RAF variant having a new, strengthened wing with no wing fold mechanism that would allow the addition of two more underwing pylons.

I'll bear the reccomendations about LERX fences in mind, I honestly hadn't considered them. I still have to decide how evolved I want the bird to be.

Thanks again for all the advice and suggestions




Mike Wren

QuoteThe matter of the Airfix Jag kit having a TIALD pod brings a question: When did the TIALD pod came into use? Was it a complete replacement for the gear in the Jag's nose?

I'm thinking of placing my A-7 in a late 80s time frame, maybe just a year or two prior to Desert Storm/Granby operations. Is the TIALD pod appropriate to that time frame?
the window in the nose of the Jaguar house a laser ranger & marked target seeker (LRMTS) which allows it to receive laser signals from another aircraft/ground based FAC etc but not to the designate it's own targets

the TIALD was rushed into service during the Gulf War for Tornados (at least 2 but probably not a lot more than that were used) which allowed an aircraft to designate for itself

upnorth

Quote
QuoteThe matter of the Airfix Jag kit having a TIALD pod brings a question: When did the TIALD pod came into use? Was it a complete replacement for the gear in the Jag's nose?

I'm thinking of placing my A-7 in a late 80s time frame, maybe just a year or two prior to Desert Storm/Granby operations. Is the TIALD pod appropriate to that time frame?
the window in the nose of the Jaguar house a laser ranger & marked target seeker (LRMTS) which allows it to receive laser signals from another aircraft/ground based FAC etc but not to the designate it's own targets

the TIALD was rushed into service during the Gulf War for Tornados (at least 2 but probably not a lot more than that were used) which allowed an aircraft to designate for itself
OK, now that I've shown utter ignorance in how the Jaguar picks its targets and with what... :dum:

SO I think TIALD is out of the picture for what I want to do, LRMTS is definitely going to be represented somehow.

F-32: Your comment about the wing mods going over budget and causing delivery delays makes it even more tempting to try it. Sounds like a typical MoD directive to make a non British plane contain an acceptable level of domestic products! :lol:

I was looking at an Airfix GR.3 Harrier yesterday in my LHS and I noticed it had the NATO twin store carrier which I thought might look better than the American TER mounting. Does anyone know if its a fairly accurate representation of the twin stores carrier?

Hope you all don't mind so many questions, I'm not a real expert when it comes to weapons loadouts as I build most of my aircraft clean.

I'm more of a JMN with my WIF projects than with my normal builds. I figure there's no point being hypothetical if you can't fool bunch of folks with it. :rolleyes:  

SinUnNombre

Hey all. I got, among other things, a Revell 1/72 A-7 for the Secret Santa GB. I've started on it with what little interior it has, but I'm not sure what markings or corresponding loadout it should have. My only ideas so far are:

U.S. Coast Guard
JSDF
Marineflieger
Israel
USN ASW

Well, Israel's not very original, kind of a cheap cop-out. And Japan doesn't neccesarily need a strike/attack plane. ASW would take some intersting mods, not really a bad thing. I'm kind of leaning towards USCG or Marineflieger. What do you guys think?

Jon

Keith Diamond

is it a A-7D or A-7E kit?  

I agree that going Israeli is the easy way out for a Whif since just about anything looks good in Israeli camo.  Let's see...

JASDF... I can definitely picture a SLUF in that blue camo that Japan uses, and with a loadout comprising of AGM-84s

Marineflieger... definitely an attractive camoflage, but I can't picture much.

USCG... I like this idea best.  Maybe a "Coast Guard really cracks down on drug trafficking" deal.  Bright white with orange band, looks real attractive.  For some reason I'm leaning towards this.  That's just my opinion though.
Man, we should have cloned twenties. Jackson wouldn't have given a poo-poo.

Brian da Basher

I like the Marineflieger and U.S.C.G. ideas best too. If you need Marineflieger markings, let me know. I've got some Maintrack transfers that should work.

Brian da Basher

ChuckAnderson

Hi Jon!

You could put your A-7 in the colours of the Kenyan Air Force.
I'm not sure where you'd get the Kenyan decals, but this would be something different.

I keep suggesting Kenya because that part of Africa has been kind of a hot spot lately with the troubles in Somalia, etc., and a strike/attack aircraft may prove useful.

Just a suggestion!!


Chuck

Jennings

The VNAF would undoubtedly have gotten them eventually had we not pulled out when we did.  The Swiss evaluated it at some point, and I believe it was offered to the Bundesluftwaffe as well.

J
"My fellow Americans, our long national nightmare is over." - Gerald R. Ford, 9 Aug 1974