avatar_NARSES2

Scale Model World 2020

Started by NARSES2, July 17, 2020, 06:50:09 AM

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NARSES2

Not fully digested Boris's statement this morning yet, he does mumble  :-\, but from what I can gather a full SMW is unlikely. We might get a slimmed down one as "conferences" may be starting up again in October, but still not sure what that actually means and besides he'll probably change his mind next week.  :angel:

I would have thought the Committee will need to make a decision come mid August, but whether they will have all the information they need in order to go with it is doubtful.

Still we shall see.
Do not condemn the judgement of another because it differs from your own. You may both be wrong.

Martin H

Might be worth cutting their losses and go for 2021 instead.
Organising for this year will be a real pain let alone enforcing any restrictions that are still required. Considering how cantankerous modellers can be it would a night mare for the centre security staff let alone the volunteers to police.
I always hope for the best.
Unfortunately,
experience has taught me to expect the worst.

Size (of the stash) matters.

IPMS (UK) What if? SIG Leader.
IPMS (UK) Project Cancelled SIG Member.

Rheged

Quote from: Martin H on July 17, 2020, 11:27:58 AM
Might be worth cutting their losses and go for 2021 instead.
Organising for this year will be a real pain let alone enforcing any restrictions that are still required. Considering how cantankerous modellers can be it would a nigh mare for the centre security staff let alone the volunteers to police.

Cantankerous??, us??  Surely not.   To  somewhat modify the original quote from Yes Minister  "It's one of those irregular verbs......I am of an independent mind, You a bit tetchy, he is downright annoying...."
"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you....."
It  means that you read  the instruction sheet

Howard of Effingham

Quote from: Martin H on July 17, 2020, 11:27:58 AM
Might be worth cutting their losses and go for 2021 instead.
Organising for this year will be a real pain let alone enforcing any restrictions that are still required. Considering how cantankerous modellers can be it would a night mare for the centre security staff let alone the volunteers to police.

I concur Martin.

If there is anything on at TIC this year, it is very unlikely that i will go. Some of my thoughts have focused on whether and how IPMS UK can provide additional support to some of the larger regional shows eg Bolton and Peterborough, but given the habits of a few modellers at shows you are right to say what you did here. Its very hard to see how it can be done safely tbh. As one problem resolves itself another rears its head so to speak.

Keeper of George the Cat.

PR19_Kit

I've just got the IPMS letter about the delayed AGM, and at last they've come to their senses and cancelled it for this year. It's all going to be done by email etc. now.

And they INSIST on following the rules of the Articles of Association!

We're in the middle of the largest crisis this country's had since WWII and they're worried about following rules? Jeez.....................
Kit's Rule 1 ) Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings, and/or a longer fuselage
Kit's Rule 2) The backstory can always be changed to suit the model

...and I'm not a closeted 'Take That' fan, I'm a REAL fan! :)

Regards
Kit

Howard of Effingham

Quote from: PR19_Kit on July 18, 2020, 02:44:58 AM
I've just got the IPMS letter about the delayed AGM, and at last they've come to their senses and cancelled it for this year. It's all going to be done by email etc. now.

And they INSIST on following the rules of the Articles of Association!

We're in the middle of the largest crisis this country's had since WWII and they're worried about following rules? Jeez.....................

Could this have been done because they were worried about some snotty nosed modeller challenging them over their rules if they were not abided by?
Keeper of George the Cat.

NARSES2

Quote from: PR19_Kit on July 18, 2020, 02:44:58 AM

And they INSIST on following the rules of the Articles of Association!

We're in the middle of the largest crisis this country's had since WWII and they're worried about following rules? Jeez.....................

Don't blame them Kit it's company law. If they don't they are in serious breach of it which can carry serious financial consequences and they can't risk getting an understanding tribunal, they might get a understanding judge on appeal but that would cost more that the original fine. It would put the existence of the Society in serious doubt.

And that's without some cantankerous modeller feeling they can get their moment of glory by railing against a decision to not follow the rules. Whatever type of club you belong to and no matter how large or small it is there are always people who belong to that club so that they can prove how clever they are at the A.G.M. Sad people but they enjoy annoying people in a safe environment. I won't stand for any committee nowadays, I'll help out in any other way I can, but the last time I was on a committee I nearly punched a certain member for what he said. I got a round of applause from the audience, but stood down there and then and have not stood for anything since. That particular club closed down for lack of volunteers to stand for committee.  :-\
Do not condemn the judgement of another because it differs from your own. You may both be wrong.

PR19_Kit

Quote from: NARSES2 on July 18, 2020, 05:49:08 AM

Don't blame them Kit it's company law. If they don't they are in serious breach of it which can carry serious financial consequences and they can't risk getting an understanding tribunal, they might get a understanding judge on appeal but that would cost more that the original fine. It would put the existence of the Society in serious doubt.


I may well be so, but that law needs to have been amended in the light of the virus crisis. 'Normal' life just can't continue under these circumstances, even Boris said so!
Kit's Rule 1 ) Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings, and/or a longer fuselage
Kit's Rule 2) The backstory can always be changed to suit the model

...and I'm not a closeted 'Take That' fan, I'm a REAL fan! :)

Regards
Kit

NARSES2

But there are far more important things to do then change companies "articles of association" legislation Kit. At the end of the day they are there to protect you and me and if you changed them, even for a limited time, some unscrupulous people would take advantage and fleece the vulnerable. Then the Government would get it in the neck for "leaving the vulnerable open for exploitation" so they can't win.

You can of course change your articles of association to give the Board the authority to act without reference to the membership/shareholders in times of crisis or exceptional circumstances. But that requires a vote at an AGM or probably a special AGM as it would be so contentious any amateur lawyers would have a field day.
Do not condemn the judgement of another because it differs from your own. You may both be wrong.

kitbasher

It's a pain in the parts but - for reasons set out by Chris - due process does need to be followed, and to be fair there is a clear flexibility and proportionality being demonstrated here (correspondence arrived today).

As for SMW, it's not just the domestic punters to consider - overseas visitors and all traders need to know.  There's already too much uncertainty, inconsistency and vagueness surrounding UK Covid-19 arrangements, I hope IPMS Central Command comes to the earliest possible decision.  Frankly, at this point cancellation seems the most realistic option.
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NARSES2

Quote from: kitbasher on July 18, 2020, 09:36:14 AM
It's a pain in the parts but - for reasons set out by Chris - due process does need to be followed, and to be fair there is a clear flexibility and proportionality being demonstrated here (correspondence arrived today).


Yup got mine today and I think the Board have handled a difficult situation well.

Quote from: kitbasher on July 18, 2020, 09:36:14 AM

As for SMW, it's not just the domestic punters to consider - overseas visitors and all traders need to know.  There's already too much uncertainty, inconsistency and vagueness surrounding UK Covid-19 arrangements, I hope IPMS Central Command comes to the earliest possible decision.  Frankly, at this point cancellation seems the most realistic option.

Very much so Dave and it's why I think that if we do get a SMW it will become a much more domestic, rather than international affair. I am still trying to be optimistic, but like you I think the only realistic option is to cancel. Difficult and very hard decision to make, but probably the best option.
Do not condemn the judgement of another because it differs from your own. You may both be wrong.

Martin H

Ok boys and girls. This came through today.........

QuoteDear Branch and SIG leaders

Clearly this has been a very difficult year thanks to circumstances that no one has predicted. As this email is written the situation still remains fluid but we are hoping that SMW20 remains a beacon of hope for us all into some semblance of normality returning.



We have been unable to communicate effectively with The International Centre as their administrative staff have been on furlough since the beginning of the lock down and only return to the office in early August. As a venue, they have their own situation to understand as well as recently issued guidance to absorb and apply. As things stand, they also have to obtain permission from the Telford and Wrekin Council for events to go ahead, and the council can change their mind at any time. It is fair to say that any degree of certainty remains short.



As you would expect we will be having a series of conversations with TIC over the coming weeks with the view that our decision whether SMW20 will go ahead and in what form will be taken on 29th August. In the mean time we would like your valued contribution to that decision making process. We would appreciate your response and any comments to the following questions please. As you will see these are aimed squarely at what do we need to provide from your perspective but whether this is achievable will be determined by the venue's guidance and prevailing concerns of, but certainly not limited to, the issues such as social distancing. Whether the venue can comply with concerns such as recommended extraction and air flows, one way systems, challenges with set up, visitor queuing constraints etc are still to be established. The answers to these questions are not definitive but are indicative to help us reach the appropriate decisions. In the first week of September we will follow up on the responses for clarity and final confirmation.



    Do you still intend to attend SMW20 as per your booking? There will no penalty on future years for any group deciding not to attend.
    If you would reduce your space, by how much/to what size?
    Would limits on numbers of members manning your stand be considered as prohibitively constraining.



If you would be good enough to respond swiftly it will help considerably in our ability to quantify the magnitude of this aspect of our challenges.



Many thanks
John White
UKLO
IPMS(UK)

I will put up a poll or two later on in the SIG members section to gauge the gangs views on the matter.
I always hope for the best.
Unfortunately,
experience has taught me to expect the worst.

Size (of the stash) matters.

IPMS (UK) What if? SIG Leader.
IPMS (UK) Project Cancelled SIG Member.

NARSES2

Thanks for posting that Martin. To be honest I'm a little surprised that they are looking at mid September ? before coming to a decision, but given there's no International Centre staff to even start looking at the prospects of holding an event until early August I can understand it.

Cheers mate  :thumbsup:
Do not condemn the judgement of another because it differs from your own. You may both be wrong.

Thorvic

Quote from: NARSES2 on July 30, 2020, 06:00:52 AM
Thanks for posting that Martin. To be honest I'm a little surprised that they are looking at mid September ? before coming to a decision, but given there's no International Centre staff to even start looking at the prospects of holding an event until early August I can understand it.

Cheers mate  :thumbsup:

Actually the first full week in September as the week before is when the final fee installment is due and the TIC have to confirm to the IPMS if the show is viable or not , it the latter we get the refund of our earlier installments, if the former they have to determine what has to be done to actually host a show with the authorized social Distancing and other precautions and if the format of the show can actually work around those restrictions or not, thus the following week for a definitive answer.
Project Cancelled SIG Secretary, specialising in post war British RN warships, RN and RAF aircraft projects. Also USN and Russian warships

The Wooksta!

With SD now being down to a metre+ and if the entry conditions state masks must be worn, then I think we'd be okay.

Besides, given the number of soap dodgers, masks would be a positive boon

TBH, I'm in favour of it going ahead and I'm going to go if it's on. There's too much fear and we desperately need something good to happen.
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