Do-335 Pfeil

Started by sagallacci, December 14, 2008, 04:31:01 PM

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sagallacci

Along with moving the cockpit forward, the upper deck would have to be extended forward as well for the second engine, as you'd need to preserve the center of gravity. There were some engineless nose designs for the Do335 family (usually jet powered versions) to borrow from for some of the look. However, you'd need a huge belly scoop or other supplemental radiator system to cool two buried engines. However, I'd suspect that a contra prop in the tail would not be as efficent as the fore and aft design, as well as being more of technical challenge. (after a quick check of reffs) Or, simply dust off the Do P252, which was a follow on design which would be pretty much what you described, though didn't carry much of the basic Do335 over to it. Longer fuselage and swept wings.

sequoiaranger

>The paired engines got me thinking. What about using the DB 610? I did a version of that -- I'm envisioning a side-by-side seat schnellbomber with a five-blade pusher prop.<

Now you've almost got the Heinkel He-119 of 1938! The He-119 had a HUGE four-bladed prop (in front) like that from the He-177 bomber that used the same (similar) engines.

Say! If you put the He-119 front on a Do-335 (DB-610) rear, you would have a four-engined schnellbomber!
My mind is like a compost heap: both "fertile" and "rotten"!

Jeffry Fontaine

So much for my "Original Idea."  I had not seen that drawing before today and it pretty much matches up perfectly with the concept I attempted to describe.  Looks good, just like I had imagined it to be. 

Thanks,
Unaffiliated Independent Subversive
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Weaver

Quote from: The Wooksta! on December 15, 2008, 07:11:08 AM
It would be a crock.  It looks like the CoG would shift back and the Do 335 was plagued with engine fires and overheating on the rear engine due to lack of cooling.  A second engine in the back would cause that problem to magnify.

I always thought they could have solved that by putting a Fw-190 style fan in front of the rear prop and using it to positively pull air through the rear rad.

Jeff: I'm sure there were some Luft '46 schemes along these lines. Might not be Do335 based as such though: I'll have a look when I get home.
"Things need not have happened to be true. Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot."
 - Morpheus in Sandman: A Midsummer Night's Dream, by Neil Gaiman

"I dunno, I'm making this up as I go."
 - Indiana Jones '

Mossie

Would you need two DB 610's?  One (with a little more development) should be enough to power it.  Keep the tandem arrangement of the Do-335 V12, you could drop the rear cockpit to reduce drag if the guy in the back is just working as a WSO.  Run a couple of intakes down the sides of the fuselage which would fit in the widening caused by the new engine.  If you were clever you could use this arrangement to reduce drag.  Even then you might have CofG issues, but you could lengthen the nose to compensate, or it might be offset by weapons or radar?  Don't think it would be any faster than the Do-335, but it would free up the nose for equipment.
:huh: :huh: :huh:

Had a quick look on Luft '46, the P.252 wasn't far off apophenia's concept, but using Jumo 213's:
http://www.luft46.com/dornier/dop252.html
I don't think it's nice, you laughin'. You see, my mule don't like people laughin'. He gets the crazy idea you're laughin' at him. Now if you apologize, like I know you're going to, I might convince him that you really didn't mean it.

Weaver

That's the one I was thinking of - cheers Mossie!
"Things need not have happened to be true. Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot."
 - Morpheus in Sandman: A Midsummer Night's Dream, by Neil Gaiman

"I dunno, I'm making this up as I go."
 - Indiana Jones '

Archibald

Quote from: apophenia on December 14, 2008, 05:12:55 PM
My kick at the can.

As sagallacci said, a bigger belly radiator and upper deck extended well forward. I'm imagining the engines being paired driving concentric shafts (à la Macchi-Castoli MC 72's Fiats) as opposed to completely separate DB 603s.

Armament is standard but the central 30mm I moved forward so the pilot wasn't straddling the breech anymore.

The paired engines got me thinking. What about using the DB 610? I did a version of that -- I'm envisioning a side-by-side seat schnellbomber with a five-blade pusher prop.

I like very much this one. It is a well-known fact that US soliders found a prototype like this, hidden in a cave deep  in the Austrian Alps. The prototype was brought back to White Sands, tested, and shown superb performances. With its piston engine replaced by a big, 5000 hp T-56 turboprop, the US Navy had now a successor to the troubled Skyshark...
King Arthur: Can we come up and have a look?
French Soldier: Of course not. You're English types.
King Arthur: What are you then?
French Soldier: I'm French. Why do you think I have this outrageous accent, you silly king?

Well regardless I would rather take my chance out there on the ocean, that to stay here and die on this poo-hole island spending the rest of my life talking to a gosh darn VOLLEYBALL.

GTX

#7
Sorry it took a while to reply - it's been a hectic week.

Anyway, here's my interpretation - note, this would be a tail heavy beast, so I added a rear wheel as well:



Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

GTX

And developing a little further - a bubble canopy variant:



Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

GTX

A two seat nightfighter variant with radar nose and upward firing cannon as well:



Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

GTX

Dedicated fast bomber variant with larger bombbay:



Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

GTX

Anti-tank or Anti bomber variant:



Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

GTX

Or alternatively, replace the engines with one large, 4000hp Argus As 413:



Regards,

Greg
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

rallymodeller

Did this turboprop Pfiel a couple of years ago. It's a twin, but you get the idea...
--Jeremy

Poor planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part...


More into Flight Sim reskinning these days, but still what-iffing... Leading Edge 3D

ChernayaAkula

Cheers,
Moritz


Must, then, my projects bend to the iron yoke of a mechanical system? Is my soaring spirit to be chained down to the snail's pace of matter?