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Rearward firing missiles?

Started by seadude, July 30, 2009, 06:55:33 PM

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seadude

To the best of my knowledge, I seem to remember reading something about rearward firing missiles being studied or developed by Russia long ago. Does anyone know if such a system is possible for fighters? Has the US ever studied such a proposal? The only example I can cite would be from the movie Firefox when Mitchell Gant was being chased by another Firefox plane and he fired one or two rearward firing missiles to destroy his adversary.
Having rearward firing missiles would definately make an enemy think twice about being in the 6'oclock position.  ;D
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Jeffry Fontaine

Sidewinder was also tested as a rearward firing missile.  Do not remember the aircraft that was to have carried it but it had something to do with a reconnaissance mission.
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Shasper

There was talk about a modified AA-11 Archer being mounted under the stinger of the Su-32/34 (with a radar setup being mounted in the stinger itself)


Shas 8)
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rickshaw

The "Pyewacket" was a disk shaped self-defence missile intended to arm the B-70.  It was able to manoeuvre at high speed in all directions after launch at relative speeds of up to Mach 7.
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dy031101

IIRC, Stinger missile was considered as a replacement to the Vulcan tailgun for B-52H.
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GTX

Quote from: dy031101 on July 31, 2009, 10:01:31 AM
IIRC, Stinger missile was considered as a replacement to the Vulcan tailgun for B-52H.

Only by Dale Brown as far as I know - see EB-52 Megafortress.

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Greg
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dy031101

#6
Quote from: GTX on July 31, 2009, 01:32:44 PM
Only by Dale Brown as far as I know - see EB-52 Megafortress.

I knew someone would mention the cowboy's Old Dog- no I don't mean that one.  I think the book didn't mean Stingers but a different shotgun-like rocket projectile.

I remember a magazine mentioned the idea of arming the Stratofortress with Stingers...... then of course the USAF ultimately decided to just decommission the gun position.
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Weaver

In a WWII context, where fighters had to close at short range and usually from behind, it occured to me to have a tube full of ball bearings mounted in the tail, pointing upwards and backwards at an angle. Depending on how heavy they were, you could launch them with ram air, compressed air or a propellant charge: either way, the fact that they go upwards as well as backwards means that the don't just fall below the attacking fighter, but hit it instead.

In a modern contest, I'm sure you could devise a device with a rear-facing IR seeker and a control system that could maneuver into a pursuing fighter. The problem is that the same all-aspect seeker technology that would make it work also makes it redundant: the fighter doesn't have to maneuver into your 6 o'clock position to fire all-aspect missile any more, so a very agile conventionally launched missile plus a helmet-mounted sight is as good a defence as any.

MANPADS are another matter though, since they tend not to have so much performance, so a fast fighter can "drag" them into a tail-chase situation. In that case, an "aggressive chaff" cartridge might have some value, creating a cloud of shrapnel behind the fighter for the missile and it's delicate optical seeker to fly through.
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Mossie

Quote from: Weaver on August 01, 2009, 05:07:53 AM
In a WWII context, where fighters had to close at short range and usually from behind, it occured to me to have a tube full of ball bearings mounted in the tail, pointing upwards and backwards at an angle. Depending on how heavy they were, you could launch them with ram air, compressed air or a propellant charge: either way, the fact that they go upwards as well as backwards means that the don't just fall below the a

Pretty much a shotgun, I like the idea.  The Germans experimented with defensive flame throwers in their bombers although they were unreliable & would often fail to ignite.
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Jschmus

Most of the newer all-aspect missiles are capable of "over the shoulder" launches, where the missile is launched forward before looping back at a rearward target.  This is especially true when the missiles are used in connection with helmet-mounted cuing systems.
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Weaver

Just tripped over something interesting: apparently some Sturmoviks and Pe-2s were equipped with a DAG-10 defensive grenade launcher, which ejected parachute-equipped grenades into the path of a pursuing aircraft. There were also various installations of rear-firing RS-82 rockets for the same purpose. Information on both these devices seems very thing on the ground, or at least on the internet.
"Things need not have happened to be true. Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot."
 - Morpheus in Sandman: A Midsummer Night's Dream, by Neil Gaiman

"I dunno, I'm making this up as I go."
 - Indiana Jones '

Scooterman

Slightly off topic but wasn't it a Buccaneer tactic to keep several para-tailed bombs in the bay and drop them in front of a persuiting fighter?  Damn that's a scary thought.  Being 'shot down' by a bomb.  Then again, ask the Iraqi MD500 crew about that. *





*first Gulf War, F-15E kill, using a lased 2000lb LGB

Ed S

Quote from: Scooterman on August 02, 2009, 07:00:20 AM
Slightly off topic but wasn't it a Buccaneer tactic to keep several para-tailed bombs in the bay and drop them in front of a persuiting fighter?  Damn that's a scary thought.  Being 'shot down' by a bomb.  Then again, ask the Iraqi MD500 crew about that. *
*first Gulf War, F-15E kill, using a lased 2000lb LGB

I guess that isn't any worse than the Mig-17 kill that an F-105 pilot got in Vietnam.  He was jumped by the MIG-17 and decided to jettison his center line MER.  The MIG pilot apparently never saw the MER and flew into it.  Scratch one MIG.

Ed
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Cobra

i seem to Remember, Don't Quote though Reading about Either a British or Spanish Attempt to fire Twin Missiles from the Rear of a Bomber or Attack Aircraft. Re:Dale Brown, The old Dog had as one of it's Weapons an aerial Mine Dispenser as Well as AAMs!!!!!!! i own that Book!!!!! Stay Cool Guys!!!!!!!!!

dy031101

#14
Quote from: Cobra on August 02, 2009, 08:17:08 PM
Re:Dale Brown, The old Dog had as one of it's Weapons an aerial Mine Dispenser as Well as AAMs!!!!!!! i own that Book!!!!! Stay Cool Guys!!!!!!!!!

No no no, it's cool.  He has some interesting ideas that's for sure- that is, as long as he sticks with American technologies.  He doesn't seem to have done too much research into foreign gears......

Well, anyway, the aerial mine dispenser is what I remembered being described as a "rocket-propelled buckshot"...... not the Stinger missiles that we know.
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